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Low limit Q's, Mark, 29. Dec 2003 18:42
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Hi all

After cashing out my biggest online bankroll yet to fund a trip to vegas, i'm back online. While I left a small amout to get started again, I lost most of it.

So, I started playing the $1-2 and $2-4 games to rebuild my roll. I'm back up to the $3-6 and taking shots at the $5-10 (short stacked though). I've been taking this time to re-evaluate my game and I have a few questions for you all.

I don't think the answers to these questions will make a big difference to my bottom line and some may disagree about the correct play, but was interested in what you all think.

For these questions, assume a 10 handed $3-6 online game. The table is loose with both passive and aggressive players. No one scares you and you are one of the top 3 players at the table.

Question 1.

7-5 suited in the small blind. SB is $1, BB is $3. Do you play the hand?

I would limp with 4 or 5 or players limping before me, especially if most of the opponents go too far in each hand. With fewer than 4 opponents, i don't think the discounted price offsets the horrible position you are in.

What if the game is $4-8 and you only have to pay 1/2 the blind?
Does the hand become playable? What if there are only 2 limpers ( the BB would be a 3rd player) in this structure?


Question 2

You have (Q8o) in the big blind and get a free play. The flop comes down Qd 7h 2h. You bet the flop and get raised by a late position player (LP). (there are no other players)

You feel it's more likely that the LP is on a heart flush draw as he tends to play top pair hands passively. So you feel his raise probably means a free card play. (2 pair or a set of 2's is unlikely).

Do you prefer to 3 bet the flop vs the free card play, or call the flop and lead at the turn if a blank falls, and why? (you know that if you get raised on either play that the opponent has 2 pair or better because he is passive).

Would it make a difference if there is a 3rd player in the hand?4 or more?

Question 3

Would you call a middle or late position raiser with AToffsuit on the button?

The raiser is an open raiser who would open raise as low as 77, A9 suited and QJ/KJ suited?

I've been calling with this hand in the low limits, but am starting to think it is a mistake. In a tighter game i would easily toss it. I don't want to muck it here because it could easily be the best hand, given the raising standards for the limit, but i never seem to win with it against a raise.

All thoughts are welcome, but please provide your reasons for why you would make your play.

Thanks all

Mark
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Re: Low limit Q's, shorn, 30. Dec 2003 06:43
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on 29. Dec 2003 18:42 Mark wrote:
My answers are interspersed.
>
> Question 1.
>
> 7-5 suited in the small blind. SB is $1, BB is $3. Do you play the hand?
>
> I would limp with 4 or 5 or players limping before me, especially if most of
> the opponents go too far in each hand. With fewer than 4 opponents, i don't
> think the discounted price offsets the horrible position you are in.

I would likely limp with this hand provided there are at least 3 limpers. You will be getting 6.5-1 on your money with 3 limpers which I find enough to see the flop. This hand is easy to get away from if you don't flop 2 pair, an OS draw or a flush draw.

> What if the game is $4-8 and you only have to pay 1/2 the blind?

Same thing for 4-8.

> Does the hand become playable? What if there are only 2 limpers ( the BB would
> be a 3rd player) in this structure?

With only two limpers, then the price changes, but it more would depend on who those players were. Are they the aggressive players or the passive plaers? Remember that suited connectors can't take a lot of heat on the flop (as small pairs that flop a set can), so if the aggressive players are in, it could be better to fold. IF you have the loose passive callers, then it is OK to play.

> Question 2
>
> You have (Q8o) in the big blind and get a free play. The flop comes down Qd 7h
> 2h. You bet the flop and get raised by a late position player (LP). (there are
> no other players)
>
> You feel it's more likely that the LP is on a heart flush draw as he tends to
> play top pair hands passively. So you feel his raise probably means a free card
> play. (2 pair or a set of 2's is unlikely).
>
> Do you prefer to 3 bet the flop vs the free card play, or call the flop and
> lead at the turn if a blank falls, and why? (you know that if you get raised on
> either play that the opponent has 2 pair or better because he is passive).

I would likely 3-bet the flop and if just called, lead the turn assuming no A or K fell (which he/she could hold as part of the flush draw). Reason being that if you are ahead, you want to make him/her pay the max. for the draw and increase the pot size if you win. If raised on the turn, you can throw it away unless you helped. Then on the river, it entirely depends on what comes and your read.


> Would it make a difference if there is a 3rd player in the hand?4 or more?

Certainly. In this case, you can't be certain that your top pair is any good here (not that you really can in the first place either), and you could face the possibility of a re-raise behind you. In this case, I might not even lead into 3 or 4 opponents with top/crappy as I would rather allow the hand to develop a little so that I can get out cheap if there is heavy action. This may cost you the pot sometimes if it is checked around and the flush card comes, but long run it will save you money.

> Question 3
>
> Would you call a middle or late position raiser with AT offsuit on the button?

NO!!! This is a 3-bet or flod hand. Calling is a terrible play because then you potentially let the blinds in. If you choose to play, you MUST re-raise to try and get it heads up. Which to choose depends entirely of what you know about your opponent and the nads that they would open raise with from those positions.

> The raiser is an open raiser who would open raise as low as 77, A9 suited and
> QJ/KJ suited?
>
> I've been calling with this hand in the low limits, but am starting to think it
> is a mistake. In a tighter game i would easily toss it. I don't want to muck
> it here because it could easily be the best hand, given the raising standards
> for the limit, but i never seem to win with it against a raise.

Raise anyway. Calling is a losing play. If you feel that you can't play well enough after the flop to win ith it, then muck it every time. You won't be costing yourself that much in EV if you were to never play this hand OTB facing an open raise.

> All thoughts are welcome, but please provide your reasons for why you would
> make your play.
>
> Thanks all
>
> Mark
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