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Server Time: 12/1/2008 9:14:19 PM PACIFIC |
 Few questions about Omaha8, Eman, 23. Dec 2003 06:14 | ||
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| As you might already know, Ive ventured off into the world of Omaha8. So far Ive only played .50/1, 1/2 and 2/4 online. Most of these tables have 6-10 people limping in to see the flop. I couldnt believe how loose and passive the tables are. After the flop if the board is ragged it even gets checked around by 8 players all the time. I am truley a beginner and play extremely tight. I started last week, and have played about a total of 45 hours and havent had one losing session. Here are a thoughts and questions about Omaha8: 1) I know im no good at Omaha8,but why am I constantly winning. Is it just short term success? Is it just because im getting lucky? or playing extremely tight is the correct strategy? I actually see less flops than in holdem and average more BB per hour.!! 2) It seems that when you have a the best hand on the turn, you dont get rivered as much as you do in holdem. Again is this luck, or are made hands in Omaha8 are huge percentage favorite.? I havent begun to calculate any odds in Omaha8. Honestly, I just sit and wait for the nuts, and thats about it. 3) I know there is plenty to learn in omaha8, and learning will take awhile, but in these lowlimit loose/passive games, will i be able to use more advanced plays that I learn? 4) what are the worst kind of starting hands that i should limp in for one bet in these loose passive games with 6 and more seeing the flop. A few example would help. Any thoughts and comments appreciated. 2) | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, starstealer, 23. Dec 2003 08:40 | ||
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| on 23. Dec 2003 06:14 Eman wrote: > I couldnt believe how loose and passive the > tables are. After the flop if the board is ragged it even gets checked around > by 8 players all the time. This is pretty common - the fact of the matter is there are only a few people who play Omaha well, and the rest play simply awful - I'm still in the middle (read one of my other posts to see one relapse into awful) I am truley a beginner and play extremely tight. I > started last week, and have played about a total of 45 hours and havent had one > losing session. The losing sessions will come, but as long as you play consistently (at least from my experience), the losses will be less than in Holdem because of the many ways you can win pots > 1) I know im no good at Omaha8,but why am I constantly winning. Is it just > short term success? Is it just because im getting lucky? or playing extremely > tight is the correct strategy? I actually see less flops than in holdem and > average more BB per hour.!! Chalk it up to short term success, but make sure you realize where you are lucky and where you are making solid plays. I looked over a 270+ hand tournament I played and was happy to find 1 mistake and 10 great plays. In the end, you will probably see more flops/hour than in Holdem, but the winnings will probably come as well. > > 2) It seems that when you have a the best hand on the turn, you dont get > rivered as much as you do in holdem. Again is this luck, or are made hands in > Omaha8 are huge percentage favorite.? I havent begun to calculate any odds in > Omaha8. Honestly, I just sit and wait for the nuts, and thats about it. If you flop a made hand with outs to a bigger made hand, then no, you won't get rivered as often - and this is the case of Omaha. If you flop trips though, and flushes and straights are available, obviously you aren't in a good situation (unless of course the flushes and straights didn't hit anyone - but that's fairly unlikely...) > > 3) I know there is plenty to learn in omaha8, and learning will take awhile, > but in these lowlimit loose/passive games, will i be able to use more advanced > plays that I learn? You can use them, but from what I've seen, the players are even more oblivious to plays than in holdem. The concept of sneakiness is not as useful (in low-limit) omaha as it is in holdem. If you've got a good hand, bet it. If you've got a great hand (top boat or 4 of a kind) then you can start being sneaky. Anything less and you are just letting people draw for free. (Don't give free cards - receive them) > > 4) what are the worst kind of starting hands that i should limp in for one bet > in these loose passive games with 6 and more seeing the flop. A few example > would help. While you are still learning, I'd suggest the bare minimum - hands that can scoop the pot in a split. If I had to pick a high-only or a low-only hand, pick the high - High will always show up, low won't. About the only high-only hands I play in most situations are: double suited connectors T and higher, pairs no lower than Ks with either connectors or suits (preferably both) and AKQQ (and this only rarely). Be VERY selective when playing low-only hands (wheels, not 6's, 7's, or 8's). | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, Mark Gregorich, 23. Dec 2003 11:44 | ||
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| > 1) I know im no good at Omaha8,but why am I constantly winning. Is it just > short term success? Is it just because im getting lucky? or playing extremely > tight is the correct strategy? I actually see less flops than in holdem and > average more BB per hour.!! In very loose games, simply playing a tight preflop strategy should be enough to win (especially assuming your opponents compound their problem of playing too many hands by playing them too passively). I agree that playing very selectively is correct in ultra loose games. The reason for this is that it will generally take the nuts to win, so if you play only A2 and A3 based hands, you will make the nuts fairly often. > > 2) It seems that when you have a the best hand on the turn, you dont get > rivered as much as you do in holdem. Again is this luck, or are made hands in > Omaha8 are huge percentage favorite.? I havent begun to calculate any odds in > Omaha8. Honestly, I just sit and wait for the nuts, and thats about it. > It depends on what the "best hand" is. In your case, I suspect it is usually the nut low with some kind of draw to the high, since you are playing only good starting cards. Provided your hand is there on the turn, only getting counterfeited (unless you have backup) will cost you the pot. However, high hands smaller than full houses are nearly always in considerable jeopardy in omaha/8. > 3) I know there is plenty to learn in omaha8, and learning will take awhile, > but in these lowlimit loose/passive games, will i be able to use more advanced > plays that I learn? Probably not too much. At some point, you'll be confident enough to step up to a bigger game where you can implement some of these plays. In the meantime, its nice to be able to learn the game while making money (I won from day 1 at omaha, so there doesn't have to be much of a learning curve, as long as the opposition is weak - there will be some kind of adjustment period as you step up, however) > > 4) what are the worst kind of starting hands that i should limp in for one bet > in these loose passive games with 6 and more seeing the flop. A few example > would help. > A45J (suited); 9TJQ; 234x; 2356; A3xx (suited) avoid: 3456; 3344; 2389; A47K; A38Q (offsuit); AA7T (unless dblsuited) Mark | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, Eman, 23. Dec 2003 11:55 | ||
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| thanks Mark. Those hands you mentioned were almost exactly what I had questions about. A3xx, 3456, 910JQ,,,, these are worth one bet preflop with a big field? | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, Phish, 23. Dec 2003 12:53 | ||
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| I think relative to your opponents, you may be much better than you realize. | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, Eman, 23. Dec 2003 13:00 | ||
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| Maybe, but ive only started playing last Monday. I have very little experience. But, I think Its kind of a straight forward game. | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, Mark Gregorich, 23. Dec 2003 15:33 | ||
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| It is an extremely straightforward game when your opponents play far too loose and far too passive. Play good starting hands, and you'll win. Period. When your opponents also know what hands are worth playing, or when they play bad hands in an aggressive or deceptive manner, this is when the game gets interesting. Still profitable, but you must earn it by playing well at every point in the hand. This ability comes from experience and time spent thinking and developing your game. Mark | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, mroban, 23. Dec 2003 17:28 | ||
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| Mark: As a player also somewhat new to Omaha8 who has had mixed success (mostly winning with a few really bad sessions) your response was consistent with most of what I have read. But 3456 as 3 wheel cards in it and while that obviously is not that strong, I have read some O8 theories that espouse playing hands with any three wheel cards in it. Since the hand can make a good low if an A flops, it would seem to be at least worth a call in late position. I assume I am wrong, but again it is consistent with an "experts" theory I read. | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, Mark Gregorich, 23. Dec 2003 18:16 | ||
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| I know Phil H. discusses this in his book, as something that top player Miami John Cernuto suggests. John insists to me that he specified that it was ok to play "any 3 wheel cards INCLUDING an ace" - didn't come out that way in print. There are times I will play this hand: shorthanded with position or in the blinds; if everyone passes to me on the button I may raise with it; and I will defend my big blind with it if the pot is 2 or 3 handed (with many more players, I don't like the hand at all - aces are probably dead, and it will be tough to make the nuts). Just having 3 wheel cards is not enough - this hand needs two specific cards to hit the board (A and 2)! I don't like my odds of this happening. Mark | ||
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| Re: Few questions about Omaha8, mroban, 24. Dec 2003 04:42 | ||
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| three wheel cards with an ace makes more sense to me. Thanks for clarifying that Mark. I cant really see how 3456 could be that strong a hand unless the flop came A2. | ||
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