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 Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, 99questions, 23. Dec 2003 05:19 | ||
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| I was thinking about buying Phil Hellmuth's book "Play Poker Like The Pros...." But, all I've heard are mixed reveiws, I want someone's honest opinion, was it helpful at all? Is it good for beginners? Thanks for your time | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, hokie95, 23. Dec 2003 05:35 | ||
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| It's more "readable" than most of the other books out there because it spends a great deal of time telling anecdotes about Phil's poker life. (How about that, a book by Phil H. that talks a lot about Phil H. Well, I'll be a monkey's uncle, I never woulda thought.....) His discussion of the play of a hand and the animal types is pretty useful for a beginner, and I think his starting hands suggestions (AA, AKs, AKo, KK, QQ, JJ, TT, 99, 88, 77) are pretty good, although I would quibble with the ease of playing 77 for a beginner. I think playing AQs is easier than 77, but what do I know? His strategy (basically, jam the pot when you have it and bet when you don't to gain information) is pretty simplistic and I don't know if it would be successful at low limits. His suggestions seem to be more likely to be successful at a game with more skilled players. It was the first poker book I read (picked it up at an airport bookstore), so it has a special place in my heart, but as far as learning goes, I would start with Lee Jones or Sklansky's Hold 'em, along with Sklansky's Theory of Poker before I would go to Phil's book. However, Phil does talk about more than just Hold em. (I assumed you were looking for a Hold 'em book. How provincial of me.) I don't play other games (yet) so I can't really talk with ANY knowledge about the rest of the book. -Dave | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, spk, 26. Dec 2003 11:13 | ||
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| I have the book and have read it a couple times, I dont care for it as my style of play is very different than phils, I have learned from it though. anyway I was going to list the book on e-bay, but if you want it I can give it to you 1/2 price let me know... | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, mkpoker, 23. Dec 2003 10:41 | ||
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| on 23. Dec 2003 05:19 99questions wrote: > I was thinking about buying Phil Hellmuth's book "Play Poker Like The Pros...." > But, all I've heard are mixed reveiws, I want someone's honest opinion, was it > helpful at all? Is it good for beginners? Thanks for your time I haven't read the book, but the "buzz" is that Phil's limit hold 'em advice is way too aggressive. In a great post on 2+2, Mason Malmuth reviewed a bunch of poker books and said the following about Phil's: "Simply put [Phil's limit hold 'em strategy] is some of the most bizzare advice I have ever read. We are told to cap the betting with hands like AQ and 77....and to usually call 3-bets from either blind with QJs or JTs. The play on the flop and beyond is also incredibly aggressive. **In my view, I don't believe anyone can win in full ring games playing like this in the long run. On a given night, this maniac aggressive approach could produce a lot of chips if you run extremely lucky.**" Mason does say nice things about Phil's strategies for other poker games, but not limit HE, which I imagine is what you're playing. I think you're better off buying Lee Jones, Lou Krieger, or Ken Warren as a starter book. | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, Schuster, 23. Dec 2003 11:15 | ||
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| The non hold'em sections are definately readable, but there's nothing really groundbreaking in there. Unfortunately the limit hold'em section suggests a ridiculously aggressive style that most would be hardpressed to pull off profitably. The no limit hold'em section is also not too bad. In short, it's not a great book, but it does have some good information spread around, and it's pretty cheap compared to most other poker books. I'd say pick it up. Lee | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, Mark, 23. Dec 2003 12:09 | ||
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| I think Phil's book is pretty good. Like the other posters said, he advocates a super aggressive stradegy with certain hands. I think he can pull this off because he plays very well post flop and accurately reads his opponents, while most of us mortals are unable to play this style profitably. | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, Mark, 23. Dec 2003 12:13 | ||
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| I think Phil's book is pretty good. Like the other posters said, he advocates a super aggressive stradegy with certain hands. I think he can pull this off because he plays very well post flop and accurately reads his opponents, while most of us mortals are unable to play this style profitably. However, he does make alot of good points and shows how to pull of the the aggressive side of Tight-aggressive. I would not recommend the book to a newbie or someone who only has one or two books. But if you have been playing for a while and already have a library built up, I think its worthwhile to purchase his book. Also, it has really helped me to understand how some very aggressive players play. Mark | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, Candide, 24. Dec 2003 10:33 | ||
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| Burn his book. Get Lee Jones Winning Low Limit Poker instead. If you are beyond that, check out either Ken Warrens Texas Holdem book, Sklansky's Theory of Poker and later on Holdem for Advanced Players are a must, as is Ciaffone and Brier's Middle Limit Holdem. No question though, if you are a beginer but understand the basic format of the game to some extent, Lee Jones book is the best. Jason | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, Top Gun-1989, 25. Dec 2003 11:03 | ||
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| I agree Ken Warren's book is very good. | ||
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| beginner review, Andrew W, 24. Dec 2003 11:01 | ||
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| Simply put, I started playing some live and online this summer with no books. I won pretty regularly. Then I bought and read Phil's book. I started losing. (I'm a low limit player) Finally got Sklansky's Theory of Poker and Tournament Poker, as well as Doyle's bible, Lee Jones LL book, and the online book by Matthew Hilger. I'm climbing out of my Hellmuth induced hole. | ||
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| Re: beginner review, Highflyin3484k, 30. Dec 2003 01:11 | ||
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| Phils book was the first I read, and I too found it extremely aggressive in the Limit HE, But I think this is due to phil's NL nature. I think his omaha section is horrendous he talks about playing almost any KK, QQ JJ or ANY 4 card str8s, 4567. I do however find the NL & tourny sections very helpful, I have noticed though he does not practice what he preach's. If I were you I would buy it, give it a look through and decide if it is your style, I absolutely love sklansky's theory of poker. and no one mentioned this one but maybe I can give the generic book by doyle brunson, supersystem. One thing in phil's book, you WILL get tired of reading about phil, thats all he talks about, him and his nine titles. | ||
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| Re: beginner review, Boftx, 30. Dec 2003 10:05 | ||
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| I think the best review possible is to watch Phil H play at the low limits (1/2, 2/4) on UB and see how much he wins. Also watch him play at the low buy-in NL tables and compare his performance. I'll tell you now he kicks butt at any NL game. | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, Mikewad, 2. Jan 2004 03:14 | ||
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| I have observed mr Hellmuths style of play and read his book. I dont think Phil plays the style he is reccomending in his book. I myself wouldnt play that style. | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, MarkO, 2. Jan 2004 10:57 | ||
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| I like Phil's book. It is an easy read, and if you pick it up and think Phil is not going to gloat on himself then why even bother? I found it much more informative than Skalnsky's "do this in this situation but not here but only if you have this configuration of cards in this seat with this much in the pot and this many player" approach. The biggest thing people don't like about Phils book is that it does not come out and say YOU HAVE TO DO IT THIS WAY. Today's society is "instant gratification". Nobody wants to understand anything and they want success RFN. Poker is like golf people...you can do it a variety of ways, what matters is the basic fundamentals. You have to know what works for you and what doesn't. The other thing with Phils book is you have to read between the lines...it is not a step by step instruction book. I have found the hold em sections to be pretty darn profitable. I think most of the people that don't like his book are not patient....if you want to play every hand you are dealt...don't read it. | ||
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| Re: Need Review for Phil Hellmuth Book!, PairTheBoard, 2. Jan 2004 12:19 | ||
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| I have not read the book but from what I gather he advocates a very agressive style based on a very select group of starting hands which he particularly favors. Phil is a very successful player. Although I take anything by anybody with a grain of salt, I am always interested in the thoughts of someone like Phil. I would hope he included some reasons Why he advocates the style he does. If nothing more, such a read would give some insight into the thinking of opponents who play that way. When I am playing I will often find myself in situations where I'll think to myself, "you know, this looks like it just might be the time for a "Brunson Move" or a "Sklansky Move" or a "Caro" move." Like MarkO indicated, the Universe of Poker is far far from being completely mapped out. Even the great Johnny Chan talks about how he still makes mistakes. You never know when you might be wandering in a territory where one of these books jumps up at you like a gas station from out of nowhere, a place for you to find some directions. On the other hand I'm also a little like Phil when he talks about having never read a poker book. When you're the best in the world, why muddle your thinking with the strategies of lesser players. lol | ||
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