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Server Time: 2/13/2012 12:09:51 PM PACIFIC |
 Hand vs. both Maniac and Calling Station, Wren, 27. Nov 2003 10:42 | ||
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| Here's a hand from last night's $5-10 session. First, some background material - sitting at a really good table full of prototypically bad players (one maniac, one calling station, one rock, a few "dedicated newbies" as well as a few others who were more solid). Tells were easy to pick up & moves could be made occasionally against the right players, but in general, good solid play was bringing in the chips. TT in the BB. 4 callers, including maniac (who surprisingly didn't raise) and calling station. Flop 973, rainbow. I bet out as there was a good chance the maniac (who acted immediately after me in the hand) would raise and hopefully isolate us. He called though, as did the calling station and one other. Turn a Q, board still rainbow. I took another stab, and then the maniac raised and the calling station cold-called. Other player folded. What's the best play here? (Actual results below) . . . . . . . I ended up folding, as (a) there wasn't a huge amount of money in the pot, (b) i had to deal with two opponents here instead of one, and even though they were both quite suspect, either one was just as likely as a solid player to hit a board. Furthermore, the calling station would play a lot of crap for one bet, but would usually have SOMETHING decent to cold-call two and (c) i'd most likely be faced with another bet on the river by the maniac. So yeah, I folded. The river came another small card, the maniac bet again and the calling station called. The result? Maniac had K3o - no pair, K high, and the calling station had KJs - gutshot draw on turn, better K high for the win. After thinking about it for awhile, I concluded that I might have played slightly too weak, but marginally so - the EVs of folding/calling down were probably pretty close. What do you all think? | ||
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| Re: Hand vs. both Maniac and Calling Station, grant pittman, 27. Nov 2003 11:54 | ||
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| Wren that is a tough call on the turn. The difficult part is that if you call you shouldn't be doing so to hit a 10. You have to call intending to pay the hand off and if either opponent holds a queen, you will be putting in money very badly. These are the types of situations where it's easy to be hard on yourself when you are wrong but keep in mind a maniac will always be making you guess and you just won't guess right all the time. Good luck. GRANT PITTMAN | ||
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| Re: Hand vs. both Maniac and Calling Station, Wren, 28. Nov 2003 08:16 | ||
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| > Wren that is a tough call on the turn. The difficult part is that if you call you > shouldn't be doing so to hit a 10. You have to call intending to pay the hand off and > if either opponent holds a queen, you will be putting in money very badly. That's just what I was thinking. Funny - I was talking to stdioh about the hand last night, and he thought I was giving up too much to fold here against these two very "suspect" players. He thought there was too great a chance that my TT was good here. But my thinking in these situations is generally why gamble with such a small (if at all) edge, when I can be taking these two to lunch in a much better situation a little later on? This example demonstrates why he's a high variance player and I'm fairly low variance. > keep in mind a maniac will always be making you guess and you just won't guess right all the time. Very true. Thanks Grant! | ||
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| Re: Hand vs. both Maniac and Calling Station, Barry T, 28. Nov 2003 00:16 | ||
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| Hi. I have not read the results yet (if they were in the post). I would muck. Whenever a player does something way out of character, I get very nervous. This incl;des a maniac calling pre-flop and then calling on the flop. I would but him on a very big hand and toss my tens. I like the bet on the flop hoping to get the maniac to raise. That was very good thinking (I know you knew that). But here (unless the maniac just took two or three big beats) I will lay it down. Even if my tens are good, the other guys must have reasonable outs. And what will I do if, say a J or K comes. Nope, I m done. BarryT OK, I will now go read how wrong I was. | ||
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| Re: Hand vs. both Maniac and Calling Station, Wren, 28. Nov 2003 08:21 | ||
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| on 28. Nov 2003 00:16 Barry T wrote: > Hi. I have not read the results yet (if they were in the post). I would muck. > Whenever a player does something way out of character, I get very nervous. This > incl;des a maniac calling pre-flop and then calling on the flop. I would but him on a > very big hand and toss my tens. The thought struck me that he was on a monster because of the lack of aggression, but he was being kind of an "on-and-off" maniac. He'd raise four pots in a row preflop, two of them ending on him betting down a very doggy hand, and then he'd call or even fold preflop for a couple hands. It seemed that when he won a pot, he'd get cocky and start pouring on the aggression. Then he'd (quickly) lose back what he made and settle down somewhat for a little while. So he wasn't one of those predictably backwards playing maniacs, if you know what I mean. > And what will I do if, say a J or K comes. Nope, I m done. > Good point. Even if I'm ahead on the turn, either or both of them could have a huge number of outs. Tx for the thoughts! | ||
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