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Server Time: 2/13/2012 12:06:59 PM PACIFIC |
 Another Dead Hand or not?, shorn, 24. Nov 2003 12:27 | ||
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| From Bellagio, 4/8 holdem. All 10 players are dealt cards, the first two players call the blind, two folds to the guy to my right. He informs the dealer that he has a ripped card in his hand (7 hearts). In my mind, all action should be taken back, a new deck should be used and the entire hand is dead. Here is the floor's decision (which still blows my mind). That players hand is dead, all action stays, and the rest of the players get to play the hand out with a 51 card deck! I was stunned. I folded my T8s in disgust and wouldn't you know it, J97 flops me the nuts. Am I crazy or was that a really bad call by the floor? a 51 card deck!? | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, Schuster, 24. Nov 2003 12:36 | ||
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| If he declared a misdeal, it kinda opens itself to abuse. Don't like your hand? Just give it a tear. Besides, not much difference between it being in the muck and just being out of the game. Lee | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, mkpoker, 24. Nov 2003 12:55 | ||
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| Seems like the worst part of this story is the poor guy whose hand was killed. Your "injury" (having to play with a 51-card deck) doesn't seem so bad. What if the player was in the big blind? Would he have been forced to surrender his $4? Could he lose his chance to play from the button because he committed the sin of *picking up the cards dealt to him.* I think that either the entire hand should be killed OR the player should be dealt a replacement card. | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, Cyndy, 24. Nov 2003 21:01 | ||
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| The dealer dealt the hand using all 52 cards. It would be the same thing had that player just mucked his cards. ( So I'm not sure I follow you with the 51 cards). If there has already been substantial action then the hand proceeds. I feel the floorman made the correct decision. Cyndy | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, MozMan, 24. Nov 2003 21:13 | ||
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| Actually, I think they should have treated it like an exposed card: Show the card to the table, burn the card, deal him a new one, and finish the hand. Then, get a new setup for the table and take that one out of play. -Moz "Hey! You made me ink!" | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, Pale Ale, 24. Nov 2003 21:34 | ||
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| Ummm no. Picture this. "I have a torn card!" (Axo) "Me too!" (Kxo) "I also have a torn card." (Axo) "Hey! Both my cards are torn! (72o) PA | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, Cyndy, 24. Nov 2003 22:00 | ||
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| I agree - Why didn't the guy just tell the dealer about the torn card as he was folding the hand? (If those were his intentions anyway, right?). If he was dealt pocket aces he wouldn't have said a word. He's not entitled to a new card. It wouldn't be fair and then who knows how many ripped cards there might be. Seriously. Cyndy | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, Easy E, 25. Nov 2003 06:30 | ||
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| on 24. Nov 2003 12:27 shorn wrote: > From Bellagio, 4/8 holdem. All 10 players are dealt cards, the first two > players call the blind, two folds to the guy to my right. He informs the dealer > that he has a ripped card in his hand (7 hearts). In my mind, all action should > be taken back, a new deck should be used and the entire hand is dead. Why? As soon as you have callers, the hands are locked. His hand is dead. can't let him take a shot at dumping a card for a new one. Here's a question for the group: when is the latest that the 7h player could alert the dealer and get a new card, without having to kill his hand? a) before any action? b) after one call? c) never? Here is > the floor's decision (which still blows my mind). That players hand is dead, > all action stays, and the rest of the players get to play the hand out with a 51 > card deck! As the others have pointed out, you let the situation addle your brain. You KNOW I'm going to have to harass you about the 51 card deck comment for a month.... > I was stunned. I folded my T8s in disgust and wouldn't you know it, > J97 flops me the nuts. Do we have to send you to Remedial Tilt Training? Why wouldn't you have played that hand, unless you feared a raise behind you? > Am I crazy or was that a really bad call by the floor? a 51 card deck!? Well, I can't answer the first part and the second part has already been handled, but you really should be upset at yourself for allowing this to screw up your brain on this hand. C'mon, shorn, I KNOW you're better than that! | ||
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| Re: Another Dead Hand or not?, shorn, 25. Nov 2003 07:07 | ||
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| Fair criticism from all, but I still don't like the floor's decision here. Not only is his hand dead, but because the card is removed from the deck, it did affect my decision to call as one of the cards I would need for a str8 was now gone. I understand that if he had mucked and it flashed to me, it is similar, but we now have a fouled deck in this case which is where I think the difference lies. There was no player error here; the dealer dealt a fouled deck and therefore in my mind, all action should be removed and a new deck should be used. What would happen if the same action occured and then the dealer accidentally dropped the deck on the floor? I believe the floor man would have required a brand new hand to be played which I think is what should have happened here. | ||
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