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Server Time: 9/6/2008 10:19:48 AM PACIFIC |
 Should I raise?, Dr_Monkey, 21. Nov 2003 06:13 | ||
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| Playing in a $1 Big Buck Tourney on Empire. Top 5 get free entry into quarter finals. This hand came up and it is bothering me. We were still far from the final table much less Top 5. 8 players at our table. 4 players including me had 10k - 11k, which were pretty solid amounts i.e. I wasn't worried about blinding out any time soon. Big stack is 20k. 2 players with 5-6k and 1 with 3k. I am EP with QQ. Blinds are 300/600. It is folded to me. (20k player and 11k player) Wanting to thin field and possibly win the pot right there, I raise to 1200. All fold except the BB who has 6k, Actually 6,742. He calls Flop comes [ Ac, Jc, 9d ] He bets out for 600.. Really don't have a read on what kind of hands he plays since he is pretty new to our table. My thoughts are: First, I was surprised to see him call my raise. Either protecting the BB or has a hand he thinks is worth playing. Second, The Ace on the flop is causing me problems. Did it help him or is he using it to scare me? If I fold I have 8k+ still. I think my options are either fold or raise. I ended up folding. Should I have spent another 1200 and raised him to keep him honest and see if he really did have the Ace? If he calls, we might check to river. If he raises, I would have to fold. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Hot Allen, 21. Nov 2003 07:25 | ||
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| I don't think it cost you much to fold, if he didn't have the Ace then he woudn't have stayed in for your raise, if he had the Ace it would have cost you a lot. My guess though is that he did not have the Ace. As the big stack he would have raised pre-flop with an Ace, even with a bet before him. His bet on the flop was most likely a scare tactic to see where you're at. Without him betting right then he would have no idea for the rest of the hand if you have A-x or your pocket pair. I could be wrong about all of this, but this is just what my online experience leads too. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, FlopDaNutz, 21. Nov 2003 07:46 | ||
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| Allen, that made no sense whatsoever. You said, as the Big stack he would have raised preflop with an A? Have you never called with KQs or pocket KK QQ JJ JTs or lower pocket pair. There are many hands he could have had by calling a 1200 bet. These are hands that are worth calling the 1200 to protect your blinds, but not worth going all in on or reraising the pot pre-flop. Are you new to poker HotAllen? | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Hot Allen, 21. Nov 2003 08:34 | ||
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| I mis-read, I had just replied to another forum where the other guy was a big stack, and carried that wrong info over. However, just calling with JTs is silly you are already beat, you need to either get out of the hand(which is recommended), or raise to make it worth your wild if you suck out, but I don't think enough money was left over to do this. No, I am not new to poker. If I was that seems like a pretty rude thing to say to a new player though. These forums are intended to encourage discussion amoung players of all skill level, and by insulting a new commer is just bad business for the sport. One should be supportive of new players. I bet you still ask the dealer to wash the cards. I've been playing for 9 years now, and I've been pro for the last 2 years. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, FlopDaNutz, 21. Nov 2003 08:38 | ||
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| Your right Allen, that may have come accross as an insult, but I did not mean it that way. I apologize for the misunderstanding. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Hot Allen, 21. Nov 2003 08:53 | ||
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| Not a problem. I've played against you online a few times, I know you know what your doing. I use many different names online (Hallen, Hot_Allen, HotAllen, HAllen, etc..). What site have you been playing on lately? I can't keep track because I'm spread between 9 different sites. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, FlopDaNutz, 21. Nov 2003 09:05 | ||
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| Mostly Party, some Paradies, and the occasional UB | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Dr_Monkey, 21. Nov 2003 09:29 | ||
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| on 21. Nov 2003 07:25 Hot Allen wrote: > I don't think it cost you much to fold, if he didn't have the Ace then he woudn't > have stayed in for your raise, if he had the Ace it would have cost you a lot. My > guess though is that he did not have the Ace. As the big stack he would have raised > pre-flop with an Ace, even with a bet before him. His bet on the flop was most Actually, he wasn't big stack. Big stack was 20k and folded to my raise pre-flop. The BB was 6k which was 2nd to last in chips. Him calling a 1200 bet, actually cost him only 600, should mean he has a strong hand? Ax? He had 6,742 and put 600 in for BB so he had 6,142. After he called me, he had 5,542. His bet on the flop is over 10% of his chips. Is he going to risk this on a bluff? Maybe he had Ax and a raise by me would scare him away? If he did his his Ace, should he check/raise me to get more money in the pot, especially if he had a high kicker? | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Hot Allen, 21. Nov 2003 10:24 | ||
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| read the rest of the thread | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, KJo, 21. Nov 2003 14:04 | ||
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| If you were just trying to win it right there (pre-flop) raising 2x the BB ain't nearly enough. That raise is practically a written invitation for the BB to play any ace, which he very well may have done. You can't call the flop with an A on board, no point putting any more money into it now. Just walk away. If you raise him he just might raise back all in. Eli on 21. Nov 2003 06:13 Dr_Monkey wrote: > Playing in a $1 Big Buck Tourney on Empire. Top 5 get free entry into quarter > finals. > This hand came up and it is bothering me. We were still far from the final > table much less Top 5. > > 8 players at our table. 4 players including me had 10k - 11k, which were > pretty solid amounts i.e. I wasn't worried about blinding out any time soon. > Big stack is 20k. 2 players with 5-6k and 1 with 3k. > > I am EP with QQ. Blinds are 300/600. It is folded to me. (20k player and 11k > player) > > Wanting to thin field and possibly win the pot right there, I raise to 1200. > > All fold except the BB who has 6k, Actually 6,742. He calls > > Flop comes [ Ac, Jc, 9d ] > > He bets out for 600.. Really don't have a read on what kind of hands he plays > since he is pretty new to our table. > > My thoughts are: > First, I was surprised to see him call my raise. Either protecting the BB or > has a hand he thinks is worth playing. > > Second, The Ace on the flop is causing me problems. Did it help him or is he > using it to scare me? > > If I fold I have 8k+ still. > > I think my options are either fold or raise. > > I ended up folding. > > Should I have spent another 1200 and raised him to keep him honest and see if > he really did have the Ace? If he calls, we might check to river. If he > raises, I would have to fold. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Dr_Monkey, 23. Nov 2003 07:24 | ||
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| Forgot to mention that it was Limit. So there was no risk of him going all in on 21. Nov 2003 14:04 KJo wrote: > If you were just trying to win it right there (pre-flop) raising 2x the BB ain't > nearly enough. That raise is practically a written invitation for the BB to play any > ace, which he very well may have done. > > You can't call the flop with an A on board, no point putting any more money into it > now. Just walk away. If you raise him he just might raise back all in. > > Eli > > on 21. Nov 2003 06:13 Dr_Monkey wrote: > > Playing in a $1 Big Buck Tourney on Empire. Top 5 get free entry into quarter > > finals. > > This hand came up and it is bothering me. We were still far from the final > > table much less Top 5. > > > > 8 players at our table. 4 players including me had 10k - 11k, which were > > pretty solid amounts i.e. I wasn't worried about blinding out any time soon. > > Big stack is 20k. 2 players with 5-6k and 1 with 3k. > > > > I am EP with QQ. Blinds are 300/600. It is folded to me. (20k player and 11k > > player) > > > > Wanting to thin field and possibly win the pot right there, I raise to 1200. > > > > All fold except the BB who has 6k, Actually 6,742. He calls > > > > Flop comes [ Ac, Jc, 9d ] > > > > He bets out for 600.. Really don't have a read on what kind of hands he plays > > since he is pretty new to our table. > > > > My thoughts are: > > First, I was surprised to see him call my raise. Either protecting the BB or > > has a hand he thinks is worth playing. > > > > Second, The Ace on the flop is causing me problems. Did it help him or is he > > using it to scare me? > > > > If I fold I have 8k+ still. > > > > I think my options are either fold or raise. > > > > I ended up folding. > > > > Should I have spent another 1200 and raised him to keep him honest and see if > > he really did have the Ace? If he calls, we might check to river. If he > > raises, I would have to fold. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, KJo, 24. Nov 2003 13:20 | ||
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| That changes things completely. I would likely raise him on the flop just to see what he does, if he reraises you fold, if he calls he will likely check to you on the turn, depending on what shows up there you might take the free card. Eli on 23. Nov 2003 07:24 Dr_Monkey wrote: > Forgot to mention that it was Limit. So there was no risk of him going all in > > on 21. Nov 2003 14:04 KJo wrote: > > If you were just trying to win it right there (pre-flop) raising 2x the BB ain't > > nearly enough. That raise is practically a written invitation for the BB to play any > > > ace, which he very well may have done. > > > > You can't call the flop with an A on board, no point putting any more money into it > > now. Just walk away. If you raise him he just might raise back all in. > > > > Eli > > > > on 21. Nov 2003 06:13 Dr_Monkey wrote: > > > Playing in a $1 Big Buck Tourney on Empire. Top 5 get free entry into quarter > > > finals. > > > This hand came up and it is bothering me. We were still far from the final > > > table much less Top 5. > > > > > > 8 players at our table. 4 players including me had 10k - 11k, which were > > > pretty solid amounts i.e. I wasn't worried about blinding out any time soon. > > > Big stack is 20k. 2 players with 5-6k and 1 with 3k. > > > > > > I am EP with QQ. Blinds are 300/600. It is folded to me. (20k player and 11k > > > player) > > > > > > Wanting to thin field and possibly win the pot right there, I raise to 1200. > > > > > > All fold except the BB who has 6k, Actually 6,742. He calls > > > > > > Flop comes [ Ac, Jc, 9d ] > > > > > > He bets out for 600.. Really don't have a read on what kind of hands he plays > > > since he is pretty new to our table. > > > > > > My thoughts are: > > > First, I was surprised to see him call my raise. Either protecting the BB or > > > has a hand he thinks is worth playing. > > > > > > Second, The Ace on the flop is causing me problems. Did it help him or is he > > > using it to scare me? > > > > > > If I fold I have 8k+ still. > > > > > > I think my options are either fold or raise. > > > > > > I ended up folding. > > > > > > Should I have spent another 1200 and raised him to keep him honest and see if > > > he really did have the Ace? If he calls, we might check to river. If he > > > raises, I would have to fold. | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Bungus, 22. Nov 2003 23:18 | ||
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| Yeah,I woulda raise way more preflop. After the flop, there's so many other hands you could put him on, a lower PP, KQ, (with your tiny raise just about any two face cards) I'd raise him 600 on the flop | ||
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| Re: Should I raise?, Bungus, 22. Nov 2003 23:19 | ||
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| Yeah,I woulda raise way more preflop. After the flop, there's so many other hands you could put him on, a lower PP, KQ, (with your tiny raise just about any two face cards) I'd raise him 600 on the flop | ||
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