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Server Time: 2/13/2012 12:09:01 PM PACIFIC |
 Thinking about pot odds, blisterfoot, 30. Oct 2003 19:32 | ||
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| I THINK I understand using pot odds to decide whether to call a bet on the Turn--e.g. if you're drawing to an OE straight, you've got 8 outs, so you should call as long as the pot is offering you odds of at least 5.75 to 1 (46/8). right? But how should I be thinking about pot odds on the Flop? With two cards still to come, the odds of making my straight are about 3.2 to 1 (if I've got my math right). So on one hand I might be inclined to call a bet if the pot was laying me at least 3.2 to 1... BUT on the other hand, that 3.2 to 1 ratio is kind of misleading, because it implies that I get two chances to make my straight for just one bet, which isn't true--if the Turn card doesn't help me, I'm going to have to call another bet on the Turn if I want to see that second card. So does that mean that on the Flop I should only be thinking of pot odds in terms of the next card (47/8), and forget about factoring in that I'll really have two chances of making my hand? That doesn't quite seem right either.... How should I be thinking about this? And by the way, before everyone jumps all over me, yes I do realize that I shouldn't be using pot odds alone to decide whether to play my draws or not. It also depends on what I put my opponents on, whether I could bluff at it or not, and...uhhh...well, what else? | ||
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| Re: Thinking about pot odds, MozMan, 30. Oct 2003 20:18 | ||
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| Yes, what you are actually talking about is call implied pot odds. Implied odds are not as black and white as pot odds (where you look only at the amount currently in the pot) because you must consider whether you will get paid off if you hit your hand. -Moz "Did you exchange a walk-on part in a war for the lead-role in a cage?" | ||
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| Re: Thinking about pot odds, Mark Barnett II, 31. Oct 2003 08:51 | ||
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| assume for the moment that all 8 outs are clean *you win if you make the straight* lets further assume you lose if you dont make it *simplicity* think of it as you want at least 3 opponents on the flop this gives you 4 preflop bets and 3 postflop bets to call one bet *odds way in your favor* after the turn you want at least 2 opponents 2 BB preflop *at least* 2 BB flop *at least* 2 BB turn *at least* this is very rough guideline to follow with lots of other factors tossed in but it does give you a starting point to look at | ||
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| Re: Thinking about pot odds, WilliamS, 31. Oct 2003 09:11 | ||
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| on 30. Oct 2003 19:32 blisterfoot wrote: > I THINK I understand using pot odds to decide whether to call a bet on the > Turn--e.g. if you're drawing to an OE straight, you've got 8 outs, so you should > call as long as the pot is offering you odds of at least 5.75 to 1 (46/8). > right? > If you are open ended after the turn (assuming you win if you hit your straight) there are 8 cards out of 46 unknown cards with which you will win. So you are a 8:38 underdog meaning the pot only has to have 4.75 BB in it for you to call not 5.75. This is kind of splitting hairs here but I think that is the proper way to figure it. Or am I goofed up? Will | ||
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| Re: Thinking about pot odds, Caldazar, 31. Oct 2003 10:42 | ||
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| You do indeed need to think about implied odds in the case you mentioned. If we're just going by odds and odds alone, the two no-brainer decisions are of course if the pot is offering odds better than 5.75-to-1 (you pay to see the turn) or if the pot is offering odds worse than 3.2-to-1 (you fold). If the pot odds are in-between, you need to predict what your opponents will do on the turn and whether those actions will give you the pot odds you need to call to see the river if you don't draw your straight on the turn. The closer the pot odds to 3.2-to-1, the more people you need to have stay in and bet on the turn to make calling profitable on the flop. Of course, if you expect everyone will check on the turn (for instance, instead of calling on the flop in a late position, you raise to try to buy a free card on the turn), you can play on with pots offering 3.2-to-1 odds or better on the flop. | ||
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