|
||
|
||
|
Server Time: 12/2/2008 12:45:59 AM PACIFIC |
 Boat beats a straight, Numie, 21. Oct 2003 19:55 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| I was playing in a very loose limit hold'em game the other day when the following hand came up. I get 9d 10d in MP and limp in as do a few others. The flop is 8 J J rainbow. It's checked to me and I bet out. I get raised by a decent player to my left in LP, it's folded to me and re-raise for information. LP calls. I put LP on a Jack with a weak kicker because I didn't think they would raise with an 8. The turn is a queen giving me the nut straight. I bet, LP raises, I re-raise, LP caps and I call. Now I'm a little confused. The river is a blank. I check-call and lose to J8 for a boat. Did I play this okay? I'm fairly new to the game so I probably did something wrong. Was there any way to limit my losses? Thanks in advance for your help. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, Blade, 21. Oct 2003 20:21 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| Im not sure why you bet the flop. I would have checked for the free card. The reraise with absolutely nothing at that point is a big mistake IMO. What information did you hope to get? He already raised you besides, you didnt have a hand at that point. That's an awful lot of for a hand that hasn't been made yet. With a pair on the flop you have to play str8's with caution. Posting here is the best decision you made with this hand. Keep working on your game. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, FlopDaNutz, 22. Oct 2003 05:50 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| Any time there is a pair on the board and some goes on a reraising spree....there is a good chance he has a boat. If he he didnt have the boat after flop and he had J with a kicker...he was betting his 3 trips on a boat draw so there was a chance one of the other 3 cards was his kicker, which happened to be the case on the flop. Your Str and two pair dont mean as much when there are 2 pair on the board. Hell a flush Ace high can often burn you if u bet it big so be careful. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, modestmice, 22. Oct 2003 06:11 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| i think the best advice for a new player here is to buy Lee Jones' book Winning Low Limit holdem and come here often for hand analysis and feedback | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, Banning, 22. Oct 2003 06:24 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| Whenever the board pairs you have to play flushes and straights scared. or at least a bit scared. And, Mike Caro says that almost all players reraise too much and I think that is what you did. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, Flatout_Mainiac, 22. Oct 2003 18:24 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| I am extra cautious if the the board pair big cards like A through T and a connecting card is on the board because folks are more likely to play connecting pockets. But I guess that is inherent in most any made straight with a pair on the board. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, shorn, 22. Oct 2003 07:02 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| Numie- I hope this doesn't sound harsh, but I think you played this hand quite poorly, especially on the turn. It isn't just the fact that there is a pair on the board, but that there is a pair and another card that is close enough to the J that it is more likely that a boat has been flopped. When a flop like that comes and you have just a str8 draw, most of the time you should muck it (unless the pot is laying you enormous odds which it wasn't here). I also do not understand your flop action. At best you should be check calling the flop as you basically have nothing now. But, the biggest issue that I have is that the player that beat you gave you the information that you needed by just calling the flop...and then you chose to ignore it on the turn! I realize that you hit your hand on the turn, but the turn card makes it even more likely that he know has a full house and his raise confirms that. 3-betting him here is throwing money down the toilet. At best, once you hit your hand, check calling all the way is the only option. I am sorry if this came out harsh...my attempt here is only to try and point out where in the hand your decisions could have been better. I hope this helps. Good luck. Steve | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, Numie, 22. Oct 2003 11:15 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| Thank you all very much for your input, it is much appreciated. The reason I bet on the flop was because I read that you want a big pot when you are on draws so that you get the correct odds to call and try to make your draw. So, I figured if I bet and got callers I would get the correct odds. I might have misunderstood what I read or applied it incorrectly though. The reason I 3-bet the turn was because I made the straight and I thought my opponent had trips. Next time I'll play more cautiously, and once again thank you to everyone who replied. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: Boat beats a straight, Blue Sky, 22. Oct 2003 17:29 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| Nummie, I'm going to take a little different approach to answer your question and probably still end up at the same place that I think you should of played this differently. I personally love your bet on the flop for a couple of reasons: 1. You are supposed to raise your draws - probably not in this particular situation b/c the board is paired - but you did receive great information to raise with the nut draw. Most new and even a few seasoned players don't seem to understand this concept and thats fine they can continue to win small pots with their big hands, but once they understand the concept they will start winning a lot more. Simple math shows that you only have to win a few of your pumped up draw pots to be far ahead chip stack wise vs. the times you miss. 2. You might just take down the pot right here. Your opponents thinking "the board is paired and I have nothing - I better muck." You just happened to be against a real hand. I don't like the re-raise on the flop. Your opponent has already given you the information you were looking for (even though he shouldn't of at this point.) I'm a little unclear from your original post but it sounds like you were heads up at this point and knew you were behind...a call is justified here, not a raise. Now if your not heads up this makes a call even more justified simply from the reason that your betting on a hand that plays better multi-way and you don't want to put the other players in a position to have to call 2 bets cold. I think even you, as a new player, should of realized from the action on the turn that you were against a made boat and probably folded, but I probably would of paid it off just to make sure. Other then showing you his cards your opponent did everything he could to let you know what he had...this will be something you have to work on - seems to me that your only concentrating on your own two cards and not what your opponent is holding. (this game is a progressive learning curve and we're all still working on it - you'll get there some day.) Although I have to admit your opponent probably should of slowed down somewhere along the line as well, unless he had some great info on you, which I'm sure you probably provdided from previous hands. He didn't have the nut boat and from your previous betting on the flop and now subsequent re-raises he couldn't be positive he was holding the nut boat when the Q hit. Overall, you played the hand incorrectly, but I think you know realize it from all the responses you have received. Keep posting here and it will definently improve your game quickly...Good Luck to you. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| POKER FORUM HOME | POKER FORUM | LINK TO US | ARCHIVE | ONLINE POKER | Copyright 2002, United Poker Forum |
|
Getting Started |
UPF Tournaments |
Poker News, Views, Rules |
Poker Strategy & Psychology |
Money and Bankroll Poker Bonuses & Promotions | World Series of Poker (WSOP) | Play Online Poker | Poker Odds & Statistics | Tournament Poker | Poker Books, Videos & Learning Tools Looking for a Poker Game | Poker Bad Beats | Not Quite Poker | Quizzes and Polls | Forum Suggestions & Bugs |
|
|
|
|
Interesting Links: Online Poker | Free Poker Games | United Poker Network |
|