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Server Time: 12/1/2008 12:14:53 PM PACIFIC |
 SNG 4th Place Epidemic, mroban, 6. Oct 2003 06:34 | ||
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| While I have certainly won my share of SNG's, lately I have had a plague of 4th place finishes. Mostly this is happening because when we get to 4 players, the play gets ridiculously tight. Someone raises, everyone else folds. So I feel like its an opportunity to be more aggressive. So I will call some of these raises (especially from the BB when the raise comes from the button) OR, I will raise from the button if passed to me and if the BB calls, then I will play him heads up. I think this is a good strategy, but here is what happened in the past two games: First, I was the shortest stack of the four. The blinds were 50-100 and I had K9 suited on the button, raised and got called by the BB (who was the biggest stack). The flop came J92rainbow. He checked to me and I raised, thinking he would throw it away. He called. The turn was a blank, and I raised him allin (which I was regretting immediately). He calls and flips over Q8. Of course, a T hits the river and I am busted. My reasoning here is that I thought it was likely I had the best hand - I had actually put him on Ax or something like that. His check on the flop didn't seem suspicious because the board wasn't a trapping board. Sure he could have had JJ and smooth called me preflop or 99. If he had QJ or AJ I thought he might fold an allin bet. Of course, that is very flawed reasoning and I totally misplayed this hand. Why would the big stack here fold a top pair with top kicker (or even a good kicker?) against a lower stacks allin bet when he has a chance to bust me? He wouldn't. I got unlucky, but it was a lousy play. He read me for the steal and didn't think I had a great hand and was right. Not sure I would have called there but I deserved it. Last night, I built my chip stack up to T4900 before the blinds even got to 20-40. I ran into some great cards and busted a few players who got overaggressive. But when we hit 4 players, play got totally bogged down. I decided to play aggressively and "bust" the smaller stacks. Problem is, their stacks weren't that small. All 3 were good players and built their stacks to 1800 through 2800. So my lead was good, but one bad play and they were right there with me. I made two bad plays, and suddenly, everyone was pretty much equal. After 20 minutes of everyone folding to a raise, the blinds got to 100-200 and I decided to be more aggressive. I got caught on an AQ against an AK. I was in the BB, he raised from the button, I called. Flop came Axx. He raised, I reraised allin. He called. K hit the turn and I was gone. Again, way too overaggressive with the allin bet. No reason to raise allin on either of these plays. Make a raise, and if called, just shut it down and try to play it for a showdown. This is a serious leak that I have developed and it seems to surface its head when I get frustrated by conservative play at the money line. Any thoughts to add to this rant? | ||
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| Re: SNG 4th Place Epidemic, Pedro, 6. Oct 2003 06:42 | ||
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| I would stop being so agressive especially when 4th place doesn't pay and you have the lead. However, I would raise hands that merit a raise. You can use your stack to an advantage but don't be raising hands that don't merit raises they have to catch you. If you help them catch you my bad plays then your beating yourself. When your shortstacked you have to take more chances.The q8 had no frican business calling and hes an idiot. That type of play is what loses the lead. He should of just folded when his flop didn't hit. It shows how bad of a player that guy really is. He got lucky and I don't think your play was bad there. When it comes to One on one 2nd pair is usually good enough especially with your kicker. | ||
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| Re: SNG 4th Place Epidemic, mroban, 6. Oct 2003 07:20 | ||
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| Thanks Pedro. I didn't think my K9 play was that bad, only bad in that I should have realized this guy wasn't likely to fold (I couldn't have put him on a hand as bad as Q8, nomatter how bad a play he made). So I think it was a bad play to put in all my chips at that point for what I knew might have been a coinflip. I agree with your analysis but I wasn't in danger of being blinded out at that point and I didn't have to play that hand. So I do think I was overly aggressive in that spot even if technically I made the "right" play. A better play would have been just to make a raise and if called, just check it down. As for playing with the big stack, I agree 100%. I was just flat out awful and playing way to aggressive when I had the advantage and didn't need to take risks. I was trying to "bully" but it didn't work. Should have just hung back and waited for the blinds to get too big for the stacks half my size. That is when I could have really used my stack to its full advantage. | ||
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| Re: SNG 4th Place Epidemic, SmellsLikeVictory, 6. Oct 2003 10:19 | ||
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| Well, obvioulsy when everyone else is so tight, you want to steal more often. But don't come in with baby raises, go all-in. Especially as small stack. The others are waiting for you to bust, so you can't afford to wait around for the two big stacks to go all-in against each other. Your K9 hand is a good example. Go all-in here. Put the guy with Q8 to the decision. He likely will not risk a good portion of his stack with this hand and you'll take down the blinds uncontested. Don't jerk around with 3X BB raises where a big stack will call and draw out on you. Put them to the test for a big chunk of their chips, which will be the case most of the time if you any kind of a stack. Your comment when you were the big stack is revealing. Yeah, get all-in with one of the other guys and often you switch places with then. They become the big stack and you become bubble boy. This is why the all-in preflop raise is so effective. Even the biggest stacks are reluctant to tangle with an all-in bet. Yes, you'll get caught by AK and big pairs who will gladly call and bust you, but very often you'll be stealing so much that you quickly go from last to 2nd or 3rd and can then wait out the bubble boy. When you're 2nd or 3rd with 4 left and the 4th has a small stack, obviously you're not going all-in preflop when you come in and, in fact, will fold some really good hands hoping that 4th will get blinded out before you tangle with another big stack. But generally, when it's late and you're near the bottom on the bubble, don't mess around preflop, go all-in or fold. | ||
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| Re: SNG 4th Place Epidemic, Tom Mc Cabe, 6. Oct 2003 11:33 | ||
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| When the tourney gets down to a battle of the blinds I wouldn't just steal unless it is mathematically an automatic profit. When a raise comes in what % of the flops are seen. Less than 50%? Raise, it is a long term profit. More than 50%? Save raises for good hands and your good hands will win more than just the blinds most of the time. There is also something to be said about defending your blinds early to set the image that it's tough to steal from you. If you can do this relatively cheaply (don't kill your stack) you may lose that hand but pick up free-bes later. "Guy who lives in glass house should get dressed in basement." | ||
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| Re: SNG 4th Place Epidemic, gary ford, 6. Oct 2003 15:53 | ||
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| is 2 games an epidemic????? | ||
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| Re: SNG 4th Place Epidemic, mroban, 7. Oct 2003 12:10 | ||
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| LOL...no but it seems that way!! I was being a bit tongue in cheek here. Just that I should have monied in both of these and didn't and noticed some similar trends in both 4th place finishes. | ||
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| Re: SNG 4th Place Epidemic, gary ford, 7. Oct 2003 14:20 | ||
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| Laughing--- I freak when i finish 4th-- i know ive made some kind of mistake--so near and yet so far | ||
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