|
||
|
||
|
Server Time: 12/1/2008 11:35:45 AM PACIFIC |
 terrifed of the flush, Ingise_Eesti, 6. Oct 2003 01:57 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| I'm currently going through a run of being beaten by people hanging on to the end and fishing for a flush and it's affecting my game really badly. Example: I get Ah Ad in the hole on the button, first hand of a 9 player sit-and-go (everyone starting with 1500 chips). 2 players call, everyone else folds, the action comes around to me and I raise 750. SB and BB both fold, 1 original caller folds, the other calls. Flop comes down Ac 3c 10h. I go all-in and get called. We lay our cards and you can imagine my amazement when I saw that he had 10c 9c. Turn brings 7s and the river Qc. There I am, out on the first hand to someone fishing for a flush. OK, you expect someone playing bad poker to beat you once in a while because after all, we all know that any 2 cards in the hole can win, the proble is that this kind of thing seems to be happening a lot to me lately and it's affecting my game really badly. It's got to the point where if there is any 2 cards of the same suit (or a straight draw for that matter) on the board after the flop that I'm terrified to bet or call (even if I'm sitting on top 2 pair or trips). If anyone can give me any advice on how to get over this I'd be extremely grateful as it is sending me insane. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: terrifed of the flush, Boftx, 6. Oct 2003 10:11 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| This won't help much, but at least your not alone. I had a flopped set cracked 4 times in a row by a river flush during a 2 hour span on Party(Empire) last night. Part of the problem was that my table image had changed such that people were willing to stay with my raises. I turned it around when I realized what happened and aggressively, and successfully, defended a blind against a steal attempt. I had become too timid in my play earlier and payed a price for it. You can use a run of bad cards to your advantage if you can get people thinking that flushes are being dealt on purpose by the software to generate bigger rakes. *Some* of your opponents might be more vulnerable to a bluff when a flush draw hits the board. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: terrifed of the flush, Mark Barnett II, 6. Oct 2003 10:30 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| i dont play this way but have read/heard that a reasonable strategy for SNG's is to gamble at the low limits hoping to get lucky and if you dont you can start a new one quickly. now just curious but why such a big preflop bet? doesnt that almost tie you to the hand? i think the person was insane to call your preflop bet but he was getting 3 to 1 odds for his all in call and thats a clear call with a 4 flush on the flop. i havent played many SNG's but the ones i have been in just double the BB preflop for raising, if you make it 4-5 times the BB raise you punish those hands that are worse than yours that call but you can still get away from the hand. *also doesnt tie them to the hand either* | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: terrifed of the flush, Dr_Monkey, 6. Oct 2003 12:09 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| I agree that he was getting 3 to 1 odds to call the bet on the flop, but that is not enough to call with a 4 flush on the flop. It is 2 to 1 that you will make your flush by the river. That just barely makes it profitable. I think this guys was just a gambler. Calling a 750 bet with 10 9 when the blinds are low. Probably 10/15? That's insane. The 750 bet probably was excessive also. Especially early in the tournament, you are going to get some crazy callers. And some of them will draw out on you. You are betting 750 to pick up 3.5 BBs? At this low level, maybe 200. Then a pot sized bet on the flop. on 6. Oct 2003 10:30 Mark Barnett II wrote: > now just curious but why such a big preflop bet? doesnt that almost tie you to the > hand? i think the person was insane to call your preflop bet but he was getting 3 to > 1 odds for his all in call and thats a clear call with a 4 flush on the flop. > > i havent played many SNG's but the ones i have been in just double the BB preflop > for raising, if you make it 4-5 times the BB raise you punish those hands that are > worse than yours that call but you can still get away from the hand. *also doesnt > tie them to the hand either* | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: terrifed of the flush, Ingise_Eesti, 6. Oct 2003 19:13 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| thanks for the reponses to the original post I made. You guys are probably right, in fact, I know you are, the pre-flop raise was excessive but I'm an in-experienced player (only been playing four months) and we all learn from our mistakes,right? I got in to poker by watching it on tv and I've finally found a hobby/interest that gets me going like no other. Obviously I'm keen to learn anything that can improve my game and that's why I'm on this site. I started off very successfully but in the last couple of weeks it's all gone hideously wrong and it seems like the only hands I lose big on is when people are hanging on until the end for a flush. I try to bet aggressively after the turn to make 'em fold if I think that the other callers are on a flush draw but I always seem to get called and 9 times out of 10 the river seems to hit for them. I suppose I need some psychology tips or something because every time I see a flop right now with two suited cards I completely go to pieces and don't know what to do. | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: terrifed of the flush, Mark Barnett II, 7. Oct 2003 10:06 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| ohhhh its gonna happen. yesterday SNG 3 people left im either first or second, i had setup the 3rd place person who was behind me perfectly, i would raise his BB in the SB with raising hands but not committing hands he would raise all in and i would fold *even though likely i was ahead* after this happened 4-5 times i get rockets he raises all in and i call he has K2 offsuit of course the flop brings double kings and i lose, a minute later with pocket ladies *played them badly* and ill take the rockets against K2 offsuit with all my money on the table everyday of the week. NL is a game of implied odds, to me its an either or game, either you want to commit all your chips to the hand or you dont. if you do then get them out there ASAP and force the other player to decide on commitment, if your not commited then do whatever you need to do *including folding* to make sure you dont get commited by pot odds alone (example above pot has 2250 in it *at least* he loses 750 roughly twice and wins 2250 once, if say you had made it 4 BB's before flop he calls flop comes 4 flush pot has about 200 in it you bet 200 he might not call but if he does pot has 600 turn misses him, now here is the hard part either you think you have the best hand now and commit and go all in or pretty much you give up on the hand. almost any bet you make that doesnt require you to call down if he makes his hand cause of pot odds *remember you dont know he has the flush draw* gives him the correct odds to draw, personally at this point i go all in or i want to see the showdown as cheaply as i can *including folding* next hand is just seconds away better oppurtunities await. btw notice how for a gambler/player this kind of hand *suited connectors*to play can be so very dangerous, it can make you a boatload of cash very quickly and if someone misplays it, your miscall on the flop can turn into pot/implied odds quickly | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| Re: terrifed of the flush, Lou Krieger, 7. Oct 2003 11:04 | ||
| View ( Message | Thread ) | Return to Thread List | |
| on 6. Oct 2003 01:57 Ingise_Eesti wrote: "I'm currently going through a run of being beaten by people hanging on to the end and fishing for a flush and it's affecting my game really badly. Example: I get Ah Ad in the hole on the button, first hand of a 9 player sit-and-go (everyone starting with 1500 chips). 2 players call, everyone else folds, the action comes around to me and I raise 750. SB and BB both fold, 1 original caller folds, the other calls. Flop comes down Ac 3c 10h. I go all-in and get called. " You might have been better off with a smaller raise before the flop and an all in bet once you flopped a set into a board that offered a four-flush and an inside straight draw as the only hands that might beat you. Nevertheless, your opponents are only going to make their flush draws 35 percent of the time in the long run, regardless of how often they seem to be hitting their hands in the short run. If you bet and your opponent calls with a flush draw and takes the worst of it when he does, you've done all you can. The cards are going to come off the deck and neither of you has any control over that. Still, if you take the best of it in the long run, you'll come out ahead. Sometimes it's that simple. Lou Krieger Raise your game with Lou Krieger, author of "Poker For Dummies" and five other books about poker, at Royal Vegas Poker http://www.royalvegaspoker.com/lou | ||
| Return to Thread List | ||
| POKER FORUM HOME | POKER FORUM | LINK TO US | ARCHIVE | ONLINE POKER | Copyright 2002, United Poker Forum |
|
Getting Started |
UPF Tournaments |
Poker News, Views, Rules |
Poker Strategy & Psychology |
Money and Bankroll Poker Bonuses & Promotions | World Series of Poker (WSOP) | Play Online Poker | Poker Odds & Statistics | Tournament Poker | Poker Books, Videos & Learning Tools Looking for a Poker Game | Poker Bad Beats | Not Quite Poker | Quizzes and Polls | Forum Suggestions & Bugs |
|
|
|
|
Interesting Links: Online Poker | Free Poker Games | United Poker Network |
|