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Server Time: 12/2/2008 7:48:11 AM PACIFIC |
 EV of selected hands, Blade, 25. Sep 2003 12:25 | ||
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| On pokerrroom.com there is a feature that allows you to select any starting hand from any position and see the EV of this hand based on all the games played at the limit (ie 3-6) that you select. I started tinkering around with this and was quite shocked by some of my findings. For example some common hands that I play from the small blind Q9o, k10o, A10o, KJo & QJo all have negative expected values from this position based on the hand history at this site. Further I was suprised to find that QJo never has a positive expected value from any position and KJo does not have a postitve expected value until 7th position (all of the above based on 10player games) If this is accurate then I will need to make some significant adjustments in my game. For example I would play all the above hands in an unraised pot from the small blind and I will usually call and unraised pot with KJo & QJo except from early position. Am I playing incorrectly. My other theory is that this EV is based on all players and as such there a many (perhaps a majority) of players who will play these hands too long or call incorrect bets and thus it is this play not the hands themselves which is decreasing the EV. Thoughts, comments & jokes appreciated. | ||
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| Re: EV of selected hands, shorn, 25. Sep 2003 12:43 | ||
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| One important point that you allude to is that this type of EV calculation is based on all players experience which is somewhat useless information. Without delineation between winning players and losing players, all you are seeing is the lowest common denominator for every hand that you could play. And, since there are far more poor players than good, there is likely some negative skewness in the sample data. This is why using vehicle such as Poker Tracker is so important for your own play. It may actually tell you that YOU play KJo for +EV simply because you play it in the correct spots and you get away from it when you should. Hand EV's need to be analyzed specific to one individual player to be of any use from a stratewgy perspective IMO. | ||
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| Re: EV of selected hands, ADAM THE EXPERT, 26. Sep 2003 03:22 | ||
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| well for the first joke, let's just say the name of the site: pokkeroom. There, that is a joke. I find it rather pathetic that all these upstart sites, try to compete with the big five. I have no respect for this site, whatsoever. The do not know how to properly structure a chinese poker game, so I looked no further. Who the hell says you can't make money on a QJ !! While this certainly is NO power house, in a low limit game, played properly, this hand is a winner. In the right hands, any hand can be a winner. Someone with good instincts, who can tell when no one has anything, can make money with BLANK cards, so the notion that this site has some MAGIC system of telling you the E.V. is a laughable JOKE. All these fools are doing, is killing their own action. Again, I will advise: If you want to make sure your money is available when you want to cash out, stick to the five established sites (no, Adam the expert is NOT with ANY site) Planet, Party, Paridise, Poker stars, and Ultimate Bet. Any other site, you are taking a chance. | ||
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| Re: EV of selected hands, Mark, 26. Sep 2003 16:53 | ||
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| > pokkeroom. There, that is a joke. > > I find it rather pathetic that all these upstart sites, try to compete with > > the big five. > Adam You are spreading ignorance with this statement. I play at pokerroom (along with other sites). They have good graphics and a reliable user interface. The games are good, and they always pay on time. Also, they have been around for at least 5 years, maybe more. And competition is always good. It forces the "big five" to continually offer more. They have to spread more games and offer more bonuses and jackpots. Lastly, i haven't played at planet since the spring, but at that time Pokerroom had more players than Planet. Mark | ||
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