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Server Time: 9/7/2008 8:37:22 PM PACIFIC |
 Giving my opponents too much credit!!, Eman, 16. Sep 2003 07:00 | ||
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| I play mostly 1/2 & 2/4 Limit Holdem on UB & PP. I do OK, I usually leave the table with more than I started with. I notice a lot of my hands that I throw away end up being winners. I think I give my opponents too much credit with regards to their hands. I know these low limit games are rather loose. I play pretty tight and aggressive when I have the hand. But I feel I should loosen up a little. What do you think? One hand that I see this happening with more often is Overcard with crappy kicker: for example: no flush or st8 draws in this example I hold K6 in BB. Flop something like K 8 Q I check and then I see raise and reraises, and I usually fold Turn and river something like 2, 7 and players flip pair Q,3 and Q,10, AJ..........I would have won. Any suggestions? | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, WilliamS, 16. Sep 2003 07:13 | ||
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| Continue to play this way and you will continue to leave with more than you came with. This is a MUCH better approach IMO than passively calling down only to find you've been beat all along. You can obviously take this too far, but when you are out of position and the action tells you you're beaten then wait for a better opportunity. Will | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, Eman, 16. Sep 2003 07:17 | ||
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| What about calling from late position with one or two raises and your hold something like J10o or QJo or K10o....I almost never call raises preflop with hands like these. But again, Ive noticed they turn out to be winners against loose players raising low pocket pairs or 10,9s..... What do you think? | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, Flatout_Mainiac, 16. Sep 2003 07:46 | ||
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| Those hands usually hit the muck with a couple of raises to me. Sometimes in one of my loose calls I might call a JT because it is a pretty good hand to hit a straight with. KTo is always mucked, QJo pretty much the same. The reason is that in a raised pot you are usually going to be up against a higher kicker if you hit your top pair. But then again, knowing your opponents does factor in your decision. I get a little looser in my calls if I know the raisers have low raising standards. I also get a little looser if the raiser was from a late position or if I know that the flop is gong to be multiway and I have correct odds to play a good drawing hand. Just my personal opinion. | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, Eman, 16. Sep 2003 07:49 | ||
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| thanks for you opinion...I usually muck them. But if i think my opponents are loose with raises...i may start calling them with these types of hands... | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, Flatout_Mainiac, 16. Sep 2003 12:12 | ||
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| Just make sure you are careful with these hands if you do call. Any sign of danger on the flop you should toss the hand away. You don't want to make your hand and spend all that money just to see that your made hand was second best. | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, grant pittman, 16. Sep 2003 07:54 | ||
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| Eman I think playing tight preflop in these type of games is a big winning play. Continue this strategy and DON'T be tempted to loosen up a lot when you see you are folding a few winners. The type of hands you are referring to are marginal ones. Waiting for better spots for your money in this type of game is a better path to follow. Keep it up and I think you will discover that your good results continue. Just a thought. GRANT PITTMAN | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, ManicStarSeed, 16. Sep 2003 10:05 | ||
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| As a beginner playing 1/2 HE at UB, I actually have been following this advice and watched on as I folded these hands in question (they would have been several full houses and straights). Feeling like I was playing too tight, I loosened up on other similar hands. I should I let them go. I just wished I played more diciplined and consistant last night as I lost $50 over 3 hours. I maximized my strong hands (winning $50 off of pocket aces) which minimized my losses. I guess being tired affected my decision making because I was not making good ones apparently. Mss | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, shorn, 16. Sep 2003 10:23 | ||
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| Playing "trash" hands like K6 in any position other than a free play from the blind is a sure recipe to go broke very quickly. You need to flop two pair or three of a kind against multiple opponents to have any comfort whatsoever. AND, even if you do flop those things, they are always subject to being beaten by a higher two pair or a 6 with an Ace kicker. Let's look at it in % terms. Below are the combined %'s of flopping two pair or three of a kind with your hand: Two pair = (6/50)*(6/49)*(5/48) or 1.5% Trips = (3/50) *(3/49)* (2/48) or 0.02% So, the combined % of hitting a PLAYABLE hand with two random, unconnected, unsuited cards is 1.52%. So, when it came to you to call a bet pre-flop, you would need roughly 50 bets in the pot to make the call a +EV play. Why do I not include flopping top pair or middle pair as playable? Because in both situations you can't possibly play the hand aggressively enough to make any money. If you flop a King, that;s great. But your kicker sux and in a typical low limit game where a lot of players play ANY King (and typically 5+ players are seeing every flop), the chances of your K6 being good is virtually 0. If you flop a 6, you have a decent kicker, but there is likely 1 if not two cards on the board better than your 6, so you can't bet it aggressively into a multi-way pot. The hand is no playable profitably pure and simple. My point here is, let all of the other players who have no idea other than "any two cards can win" be the one's to show YOU K6 for top pair when you are holding your AK. Save your money for when you have the best of it and NEVER lament folding a hand pre-flop that "hits" after you have folded this ONE time. Do NOT let that influence the next time you see the same garbage hand. Lastly, when you are starting out, buy and live by Lee Jones "Winning Low Limit Hold'em" starting hands and "trash" hands chapters. I guarantee that the advice given there WILL make you $$. Good luck. Steve | ||
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| Re: Giving my opponents too much credit!!, Blade, 16. Sep 2003 10:48 | ||
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| I think this a difference of winning a lot of pots and winning a lot of money. Certainly if you loosen up you hand requirements you will win many more pots. However you will also lose many more showdowns and on the showdowns you do win will not have a maximized pot because of your inability to play them aggressively. I say go in with a strong hand and punish your opponents mercilessly. Let them win with K6. It will keep them playing just enough to send their money your way. | ||
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