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Server Time: 11/20/2008 2:34:05 AM PACIFIC |
 Omaha pot limit, Curtis Walker, 10. Sep 2003 11:35 | ||
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| It is 3 handed after the flop. Qh,8h,5s. I have pocket Queens for top set. There is $700 in the pot. I bet $500. 2nd player calls and 3rd player goes all in for $1700.00. I call and 2nd player also goes all in for the 1700. 4th street brings 4s and of course 5th street was a heart. 3rd player showed nut flush. 2nd player had flush and full wrap. His statement was, I was the underdog all the way. was he correct and did I overplay the hand. I think I would do the same thing again. | ||
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| Re: Omaha pot limit, Rolf Slotboom, 11. Sep 2003 06:36 | ||
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| No, while he MAY have been correct that heads up your hand would have been a slight dog to his (with two cards to come), in a three-way pot against two draws you are a huge money favorite. So, you were definitely right to put all your money in on the flop. One thing, though. Assuming you had about $1700 as well, why did you bet $500 on the flop, rather than the pot ($700). If both you and your opponents hold a $1700 stack, this may actually be the WORST POSSIBLE AMOUNT to bet. Either bet small (so that if on the turn a flush card comes you will simply check and fold) or bet so much that you are pot-committed: if you bet $700 of your $1700 stack, then you know you are not going to second-guess yourself later in the hand, even if a bad card comes up. If you get called and say, a flush card comes up, then you know you are still not going to fold, and put in your last $1000 as well, with either $2100 or $2800 in the middle already (depending on either one or two callers on the flop). But by making this medium bet, you are making it relatively cheap for your opponents to hit their draw, and on the turn they can still bet so much that you may be forced to fold. In fact, they might even bluff or semi-bluff you out if a scare card comes up, because they KNOW that if you hold top set, you will probably not call an additional $1200 for an (at best) ten-outer when there's only $1700 or $2200 (depending on either one or two callers on the flop) in the middle. They may or may not be right, but the fact remains that a medium bet in this situation, with these stack sizes and this type of flop, is significantly worse that either a small or a very big bet. (If you had a stack of about $800-1000, then I would say your bet of $500 WAS okay). Hope this helps, Rolf. | ||
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| Re: Omaha pot limit, noiseboy, 11. Sep 2003 09:05 | ||
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| You are the dog IF both a flush draw and a the wrap are out there; however, you do have some serious outs to make the full. The problem is that if you have top set, you can't really know when both the flush and the wrap are out there, so it can be a lot of trouble for you. Top set is a hand you usually have to play since you can't know that you are a dog. As a disclaimer, I should tell you that I'm still far from an expert at PLO, but I'm trying to learn it too. Good luck! | ||
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| Re: Omaha pot limit, noiseboy, 11. Sep 2003 09:56 | ||
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| Rereading my reply, I realized that some of it isn't correct. Once again, I should know better than to post before my morning coffee. :) You may be a dog to win the hand, as one of the two draws will get there over 1/2 the time, but with two people in there, you are a money favorite as Rolf points out. You are less than 50% to win the hand but you are a money favorite. You could go to twodimes.net to figure out the exact percentages. Anyway, if you were head-up against one player with both a wrap and a flush draw, then you would win less than your fair share (50%). Since there are two players, you only need to exceed 33 1/3% to win more than your fair share and you are above that. This is a situation where in a tourney, I'd probably bet big to lose the draws, or make them pay through the nose if they want to roll the dice to bust me. In a ring game, I might make a smaller bet, see the turn, if it's not threatening, I know a big bet will probably lose them as they are much bigger dogs with only one card left. BTW, welcome Rolf, I really liked your series on heads-up play, as that was one of my weak points. I usually play smaller tourneys where there usually is a deal at the end, so I didn't have much experience in that regard, so your articles were quite useful to me. | ||
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