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Server Time: 12/1/2008 5:48:34 PM PACIFIC |
 Bad play, bad beat?, Schuster, 23. Aug 2003 16:47 | ||
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| There's 79 out of 800+ folks left in a no limit tournament. Pay goes down to 70. The blinds are 400/800 and my table is playing squeeky tight. There's 9 at my table, and I have 6200 in chips. The average is about 9000. I open for a raise to 2000 UTG with Ad Jd. It's folded to the big blind who calls with 12900 left in his stack. Flop is Jc Qd 9d. The big blind bets the minimum 800 into me. I think for a while and decide that I'd much rather have a real shot at the big money than barely slide into the low money then blind out. I go all in for 4200. What would you do in this situation? I'll post the results in a separate message. Lee | ||
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| Re: Bad play, bad beat? - results, Schuster, 23. Aug 2003 16:49 | ||
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| He called the all in with an offsuit AK and caught a 10 on the river. I guess being that I thought so long, I was bluffing and his AK high was the best hand? I'm not sure what to think of it really, I was really surprised he called when I saw the cards. Oh well, that's poker! Lee | ||
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| Re: Bad play, bad beat?, Roy Cooke, 23. Aug 2003 18:33 | ||
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| I move it all in....I think you made the right decision! Roy Cooke on 23. Aug 2003 16:47 Schuster wrote: > There's 79 out of 800+ folks left in a no limit tournament. Pay goes down to > 70. The blinds are 400/800 and my table is playing squeeky tight. There's 9 at > my table, and I have 6200 in chips. The average is about 9000. I open for a > raise to 2000 UTG with Ad Jd. It's folded to the big blind who calls with 12900 > left in his stack. Flop is Jc Qd 9d. The big blind bets the minimum 800 into > me. I think for a while and decide that I'd much rather have a real shot at the > big money than barely slide into the low money then blind out. I go all in for > 4200. What would you do in this situation? I'll post the results in a separate > message. > > Lee | ||
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| Re: Bad play, bad beat?, Barry T, 24. Aug 2003 06:13 | ||
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| Hi. I see thagt you were ahead, but you could easily have been behind when you pushed all in, and I am not fond of that move. On this hand, I prefer to flat call the flop. First, you may improve. Second, something very scary might come and you might be able to get off the hand. Third, he might check when a blank comes and then you can go all in. I suspect option three is what will happen here. BarryT | ||
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| Re: Bad play, bad beat?, Andrew Wells, 24. Aug 2003 10:30 | ||
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| This is a strange situation where you may already have or make the best hand, but you could also be significantly behind or even drawing dead by the turn. Having decided that you can commit all your chips in this spot on the flop, doesn't always mean that you need to push in right away. Your opponent has you covered without being short enough to risk getting blinded out if you win. This means you are more likely to get called if you move on the flop. I'd like to wait for the turn in case a bad card falls, just to keep alive the possibility of releasing the hand. I think what is needed here is a small raise back on the flop, just to try and obscure things a little for your opponent. You're still going to go all-in if you get reraised, but this way you might get backed off (if the bet on the flop was to see where you were at). This is not the sort of board where someone is making a small bet trying to trap you into a raise, as any hand that may want to do that is certainly vulnerable to some kind of redraw. So it looks like your opponent is also a little uneasy about the flop. I would make it 2000 (raising 1200) on the flop. If you get played back, then take a stand. You might not get bet into on the turn if you are just called, which is what you are looking for. However you have made your stack small enough relative to the size of the pot and your opponents stack to get called on the turn if you improve. You have also left yourself with enough to survive the next set of blinds, if necessary. Usually I would advocate moving all-in when there's a decent chance your opponent will fold, but I think this hand is a rare exception. There's a good reason why AJ is such a tough NL hand, your example reinforces this. | ||
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| Re: Bad play, bad beat?, 4 POKER, 24. Aug 2003 10:52 | ||
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| Great analysis on this hand Andrew. This post is "exceptional", it really is! | ||
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| Re: Bad play, bad beat?, palman, 24. Aug 2003 11:05 | ||
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| I really don't like the AJ UTG raise, because if anyone calls, you're rarely a slight favorite, and either a small dog or a huge dog preflop. I think with the blinds of 400/800, and your stack of 6200, you can see a good 20 more hands before you get into the position where you need to really make moves, and you should find a better hand/position in those 20 hands than this one. If you just double the blinds, the person UTG will go over the top of you with AK, which I don't think you can call with AJ, and if he doesnt have a solid hand, he has enough chips to just call virtually any hand, thus you won't be able to accurately put him on a hand after the flop, which isn't a good position to be in when going all in. Mucking it may be the best option, mainly for positional reasons. | ||
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| Re: Bad play, bad beat?, Andrew Wells, 24. Aug 2003 12:05 | ||
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| Mucking preflop from that early a position is certainly a valid alternative. It looks like Schuster was willing to take on some risk in an attempt to build a stack against a table playing bubble tight. Doing this UTG with a marginal hand like AJs is a matter of player style. I don't fault him for taking the shot, nor do I think your approach is wrong. | ||
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