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Server Time: 2/13/2012 6:53:58 PM PACIFIC |
 Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, Boftx, 12. Aug 2003 16:50 | ||
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| After reading the description of the RNG and shuffle routine at UltimateBet, it appears that they have altered what I consider to be a fundemental part of Hold'em. Specifically, they do NOT use a static deck thru-out the hand. That is, they do not shuffle a deck before a hand then deal it out unchanged. Instead, they pick EACH CARD randomly AT THE TIME it is actually dealt based on the RNG stream. This means that the time you take to act, or someone else, will alter what card comes up next. I find this troubling. It has always been a truism that once the deck is shuffled the outcome of the hand is known from then on and you can know that you made a good decision to fold or shoulda "hung in there" for the river. At UltimateBet this would appear to NOT be the case. Instead, you must forever wonder if you had acted quicker or slower the outcome woulda changed. Any comments out there on this? | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, Guru, 12. Aug 2003 16:56 | ||
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| I wonder if that dealer would have just fanned the cards a couple of more seconds on the table or if he would have shuffled one more time or pulled the cards in a little more with his right hand than the left ... if he had done those things, I wonder if he would have dealt me a royal flush. The cards are random for everyone... it's how you play them that counts. | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, Boftx, 12. Aug 2003 17:01 | ||
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| True, but there is a certain sense of comfort knowing that once the dealer has shuffled and dealt, the order is fixed no matter what you, or others, do. Now it will feel the same as in stud or draw where you wonder what card you would have gotten if the other guy stayed/folded etc. | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, stdioh, 12. Aug 2003 17:05 | ||
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| Not true. What happens if the dealer accidentally exposes the turn card before it is time? He shuffles it back in and the order of the deck has changed. | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, stdioh, 12. Aug 2003 17:04 | ||
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| How is that different from a 7 card stud game? If player X folds instead of calling you see a different card on 5th street than you would otherwise get. It is irrelevant since the cards are randomly stacked. The continuous shuffle allows things to be safer since if the deck was pre-arranged it would conceivably be possible for somebody to gain priveledged access to the system, see what future cards would be, and play the hand knowing the future. Then those people could shout ONLINE POKER IS RIGGED FOR SUCKERS or whatever and maybe be heard. Because of the continuous shuffle you can say with confidence that the players who do stupid things on early streets and get there in the end against all odds don't have a "special program" | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, Jav, 12. Aug 2003 17:56 | ||
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| It is different, however if you decide to play it it makes absolutely no difference in how you should play. Every decision you make in poker should be based on your probability of winning the hand vs. how much money is in the pot. You change your probability of winning based on many many things, but one of them is not how the next card is determined. As long as there is no way for anyone to know which one of the remaining cards is going to come next; and every remaining card has the exact same likelihood of being the next card chosen; then the game is exactly the same. You will make every decision exactly like you would before. To me, that means it's really the same game... | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, gary ford, 12. Aug 2003 19:13 | ||
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| on 12. Aug 2003 17:56 Jav wrote: > It is different, however if you decide to play it it makes absolutely no difference > in how you should play. > > Every decision you make in poker should be based on your probability of winning the > hand vs. how much money is in the pot. You change your probability of winning based > on many many things, but one of them is not how the next card is determined. As long > as there is no way for anyone to know which one of the remaining cards is going to > come next; and every remaining card has the exact same likelihood of being the next > card chosen; then the game is exactly the same. You will make every decision exactly > like you would before. To me, that means it's really the same game. I'm not sure the purpose of the original post but it kinda sounds like the whiners at a blackjack table who say you got MY card or why did you hit that card would have busted the dealer. These paranoid THE GAME IS RIGGED losers are putting an unnecessary cloud over online poker just as the casino players are sniping at the auromatic shufflers..This is the time to boost online poker and to advocate automatic shufflers--- anything that will fuel the boom!!!! Gary | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, Boftx, 13. Aug 2003 09:15 | ||
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| My original post was not meant as a whine, but merely an observation. As I stated before, there is a certain sense of satisfaction, at least for me, in knowing that no one else's actions will have an effect on the cards I am given to work with in Hold'em as opposed to stud or draw and this is a fundamental property of Hold'em. I am well aware that the decisions I make on how to play my hand are based on my expectations of other people's actions and reactions, as well as probabilities of what cards are available. My problem (and I realize that it is indeed "my problem") is that I will now wonder upon occasion whether that extra second I took to decide will change the next card from one that fills my boat to one that leaves me with 2 pair losing to a flush. :-) | ||
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| Re: Deck Shuffles at UltimateBet, LJH, 13. Aug 2003 07:26 | ||
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| DEAR BOFLIX, WHAT DIIFERENCE DOES IT MAKE AS THE SHUFFLE APPLLIES EQUALLY TO ALL PLAYERS IN THE GAME. LJH | ||
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