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Server Time: 12/1/2008 11:03:39 PM PACIFIC |
 Omaha H/L (SnG- shorthanded?), pt_Gatsby, 12. Aug 2003 11:14 | ||
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| I'm fairly new to Omaha h/l, but I seem to do moderately well at the low tables (as many have noted, you tend to do really well, or really bad... large edges and all that). More that others play it badly than me well! I started playing originally to improve my ability to read the table and odds. Omaha sure does that (4 cards, reading the potential hands you can get certainly is an excersize at first). I played in my first Limit Omaha SnG last night, and I came moderately close to dominating. Granted, I got some good hands - but omaha is full of good hands. A couple of KKA2ish hands got hit for the nuts (You gotta love having AK4 come up on the flop!), but I was willing to withdraw from hands where I had second best and managed to be chip leader from quite early. Throughout the game, my variance was very low... However! When it came down to three people (rough chip stacks were me at 6000 vs , 3000+3500) I had no idea how to play. I have never played short stacked Omaha, and in the end, I went on tilt (it was past my bedtime, with work approaching) due to the frustration of having split hand after hand, with no chips moving anywhere. I started throwing money at good (but not great) hands on the theory that less people = less good hands. However, 3 hands in a row failed to get hit (including AA24 single suited, low or high) and I just threw my chips on the last hand to get it over with - clearly not a winning strategy, but I really felt lost at this point. Does anyone have any comments on how to play the final hands? We were at level 8 (!!!) by this time. Is it unusual to have everyone(limit omaha h/l) stay in till level 4? (we had all 9 still). On a single hand, 2 got busted and one got shortstacked, then everything calmed down for a couple of levels, and multiple people got busted back to back shortly after. Is that normal? Is there a lot of 'waiting' for blinds, searching for the nuts (and failing!)? It seems to me the optimal strategy in tournament H/L is to play only when you have the nuts, but to almost play any hand that *can* get the nuts. When you get dealt mid range hands (88A3 with A suited) that have the potential of being hit, you should see the flop? I can't count how many times people doubled up, if not more with a hand like that (We had 6 4ofakinds in the tournament, total)... At what point does that stop being true? With three people, can you continue to fold (BB being 1/16 or 1/8 of your chips!) bad hands? Do you reraise any potential hand? What if you don't flop the nuts, and he starts betting at you? I would appreciate any comments on tournament H/L, or any suggestions for reading. I misread one hand last night which hurt, but otherwise I seem fairly good at reading the cards. Mostly I cannot figure out how to play it tournament style... it was way different than holdem tournaments! | ||
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| Re: Omaha H/L (SnG- shorthanded?), Mark Gregorich, 12. Aug 2003 14:25 | ||
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| I'm not really familiar with Omaha 8/b sit n go's, or SNGs in general, for that matter, but I suspect they operate similar to satellites or at least resemble mini-tournaments. However, I think I can make a few comments on the nature of omaha tournaments and shorthanded play. First, you comment on waiting to play mostly the nuts. In a full table type situation, I believe you can get away with this (actually, playing ring game omaha is largely about playing the nuts), but when the table gets short, play changes dramatically. In a ring game, you can generally make a profit with just a low hand, but shorthanded you really need to scoop to make money. Thus, 2-way hands become more valuable (headsup, I'd rather hold A35K than A234, for example, although with 6 players in, I prefer the ABCD). If you play too tight 3 handed, the blinds will eat you alive. You simply must get in there and gamble. The value of likely winning hands changes, too. In a full game, you generally need the nuts or close to it to win the pot, simply because most of the cards are out. Shorthanded, though, top pair will often take the money, particularly if the board is paired (making it tougher for anyone to have a straight, flush, or random 2 pair). Also, ANY low will frequently win that side of the pot, making hands like 3567, which are completely unplayable in a ring game, certainly worth defending your big blind with, and often worth a raise on the button in a 3 way situation (especially if the blinds play too tight). Shorthanded, its important to take advantage of opponents who play too tight. This means attacking their blinds at every opportunity. If your opponents call every raise, then you can limp on the button with decent hands (which I wouldn't generally recommend in hold-em). If your opponents keep raising you with garbage, you're going to have to defend your blinds with less than premium hands to avoid being run over. Just remember that you don't need to make the nuts in shorthanded omaha, just a hand thats better than your opponent's. When I flop top pair (sometimes less) and any low draw playing in a 3 handed or headsup game, I consider that a pretty good flop, and frequently play the hand aggressively, depending on how my opponent plays. I hope this was helpful; I'm not sure I addressed your questions specifically but these are a few of my personal observations from playing shorthanded omaha 8/b. Mark | ||
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| Re: Omaha H/L (SnG- shorthanded?), pt_Gatsby, 12. Aug 2003 14:40 | ||
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| Thanks, that helped quite a bit actually. I'm an overly technical player, which is why I felt so out of touch at the end... didn't have a clue what I was doing. I'll have to try playing in a few more to get a feel for the final hands. As with holdem, the value of the hands does change dramatically, and I can see your point about aiming for both. I just find it hard to know where I stand in shorthanded, whereas I could name the winning percent for all of the holdem hands... Guess its time to hunt out some low limit tables that are shorthanded! Nothing quite like expierence. | ||
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| Re: Omaha H/L (SnG- shorthanded?), 4 POKER, 12. Aug 2003 14:48 | ||
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| Great post Mark. Indeed.....shorthanded Omaha plays differently than a full ring game, and you need to hold hands that can go in both directions more easily. The A-K-5-3 hand vs. A-4-3-2 hand is a good example of just that. The K really gives the hand alot more strength against a small field because it has a chance at hitting the high straight, and two top pair, *and* just having the K as a kicker will sometimes come into use here....plus you also have low draws with it as well. And yeah, most definitely you can't sit there and wait for the real premium hands as you look to wait for when the game is full. | ||
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