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On Cheating, stdioh, 28. Jul 2003 09:00
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This interesting exchange between Russ Georgiev and Mike Caro took place on RGP, and I'm going to repost it here out of curiosity as to what players here think.
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Mike Caro &lt;caro@caro.com>; wrote in message news:<jku5ivgop0tv796va9epmg1k12rla7lcgj@4ax.com>;...
> On 26 Jul 2003 14:12:02 -0700, RussGeorgiev@aol.com (Russ Georgiev)
> wrote:
>
> >Any comments Mike Caro, David Sklansky, Eric Drache, Doyle Brunson,
> >Puggy Pearson, Pat Callahan and any of you many others? Or does this
> >touch to close to HOME?
>
> Russ --
>
> There was large-scale cheating at the Stardust in the 1970s and maybe
> afterward. I complained to management about it back then. It was
> obvious and, often, in-your-face, as if the culprits were getting a
> particular thrill out of the fact that they couldn't be stopped.

They couldn't be stopped, unless the place went out of business. Then
they would go somewhere else. By the way, Pat Callahan, Johnny Chan
and others played here, or aren't you aware of this?



>
> I don't know who the cheats were, by name, but I know cheating was
> rampant. One instant I discussed happened during the production of
> Doyle Brunson's Super/System. I started out in razz hand with four low
> cards and a rounder kept raising with two face cards showing!

And they had a SUCKER continue to raise. Are you the same guy from
Gardena, Mike?



>
> I'd been warned about this and interrupted the game to call the
> manager and ask for a shuffle. When the request was refused, I even
> turned my cards face-up and offered to take half the pot right then.
> They wouldn't allow it and the opponent made one final indignant
> raise. I called, mostly to prove my point. I lost.

You proved your point, nothing you could do to stop it. By the way,
did you forget who warned you also?



>
> I've discussed this many times. My question has always been, why were
> the thieves so blatant? Maybe you have an insight about that. Wouldn't
> they have done much more business with a little subtlety? After all,
> the word was all over town.

Because it didn't matter. What happened when you complained? Nothing.
You either lose or you leave, Of course you could have caused a
bigger commotion and we wouldn't have the pleasure of talking to you
today.



>
> Anyway, Russ, I'm not sure what you want me to say, but I'm honored
> that you value my opinion. My opinion is that most sophisticated
> old-time players have known for a very long time about the scams that
> went on at the Stardust.

Your opionion, what a joke! Just wanted to have the people see what
happened if you complained about the cheating. NOTHING NOTHING
NOTHING

Then the cheats all moved to the Golden Nugget, and had Eric Drache
provide them with security. The cheats have the power. I didn't have
to confess Mike, I just did it to get the issue addressed. Or don't
you believe I am a cheat? By the way, unless these cheats are dead,
then are still at work in Vegas. Funny you wouldn't remember their
names. One of them was JOhn Martino, maybe you remeber him?

All your monitoring, all your complaints and everything else have
accomplished nothing to stop or even halt cheating in any degree. I
have done far more in my limited tome in my way than you ever hoped.
The games are as filty as ever and we had to stop being so blatant
because of the big corporations.

Russ Georgiev

>
> Straight Flushes,
> Mike Caro
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