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Server Time: 11/22/2008 12:54:35 AM PACIFIC |
 Thoughts on A-x offsuit, spawgan, 20. Jul 2003 20:38 | ||
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| Just wanted to get thoughts of playing A-X offsuit in both limit and no-limit. While I know that Ak and AQ are power hands (atleast part if Hellmuth's top 10) I am more interested in A-t and lower | ||
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| Re: Thoughts on A-x offsuit, Easy E, 20. Jul 2003 20:43 | ||
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| Generally, pretty crappy. Heads up, a hand to show some strength with if A-medium. NL- only at the end, and only cheaply AND carefully. Limit- AT, A9 are okay, not great. If players will play any Ace, then becomes stronger. Lack of suitedness doesn't help it much | ||
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| Re: Thoughts on A-x offsuit, 4 POKER, 20. Jul 2003 21:11 | ||
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| Hey spawgan, This is how I feel about A-x offsuit in limit hold-em: Everything depends on the game that you are in. Are you playing in a shorthanded game, or a full game? Are the players known to be loose, or are they pretty tight for the most part? If the game is full I wouldn't even bother with A-x unless I'm trying to win the blinds. If I'm sitting in a 6 player max table (which is what I prefer)....if I'm on the button with A-x, and everyone has folded to me, I will raise with this hand quite often just to try and steal the blinds because Ace high against the two blinds is not a bad hand, but you also have to be careful if you get called and feel that your Ace high or even your top pair (Ace) will not win the pot. (But I will still play it as a "blind stealer"). Other than that, I don't play A-x offsuit from any position....if an Ace does flop, there will be too many kicker problems for you to face and it would be hard for you to be aggresive with the hand like you should be when you enter a pot, and than make top pair w/two rags. Being suited with A-x will help somewhat if you play it in a position where you are able to just call one bet (LP, or on the button), but when I do play that type of hand, I'm looking to hit the flush and will not get carried away if I flop top pair Ace and there is too much betting on the flop. Even being suited....I prefer to play that type of hand when I'm trying to steal the blinds or if I'm in one of the blinds and I think the button steal raiser or the other blind has an inferior holding to mine. But, if the game is fairly passive and you think you could get in cheaply with A-x *suited*, than I'll occasionally make the call, but I would still fold it for any substantial raises. All in all, when I play an Ace, I want the kicker to be a strong one so I may have a better chance at winning the pot if an Ace does fall. 4 POKER | ||
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| Re: Thoughts on A-x offsuit, cold_cash, 20. Jul 2003 23:45 | ||
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| In my experience (which is no doubt limited) playing Ax offsuit is just a way to get yourself into trouble. Ask yourself before you enter a pot "what am I hoping to flop w/ these 2 cards?". If an ace comes up, you can't play aggressively because you have kicker problems. If an ace doesn't come up you probably have just one overcard, or second or bottom pair. (If you do flop top pair, chances are it won't be top pair for very long.) I think the only way you can play this hand aggressively (like you want to) after the flop is if you catch an almost miracle two pair flop. That's not going to happen enough to justify entering many pots with Ax offfsuit. I fold 'em. Also, it's always nice to get called down on the river by someone holding Ax after an ace has come on the flop and you have AK AQ or AJ. I think you can do yourself a favor by NEVER being that guy. Fold and don't put yourself in that position. Maybe another way to think about it is looking at how you play Ax suited. What happens if you see a flop with say, A5 of spades, and an ace is flopped, but no spades? How long do you stay in? Probably not very long if there's any real action going on. So, if you're playing Ax offsuit, you'll be in the exact same position, but you got yourself into the situation without even having the possibility of a flush draw. (Which is presumably the ONLY reason to play A5s in the first place.) | ||
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| Re: Thoughts on A-x offsuit, Mark, 21. Jul 2003 08:10 | ||
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| I only play Ax offsuit in short handed situations. Once your down to 1 or 2 opponents, the Ace becomes very valuable. In No Limit i will limp with A3 to A5 offsuit, hoping to flop a monster. (the blinds have to be small compared to my stack) I won't limp with A2 because it doesn't have str8 value (I don't want to play an ignorant end str8) mark | ||
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| Re: Thoughts on A-x offsuit, ezcheese, 21. Jul 2003 09:23 | ||
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| I play extremely loose house games and I will limp in with Ax offsuit just to see a flop and hopefully 2-pair... I almost always go in with Ax suited though... which is a whole different story. | ||
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| Re: Thoughts on A-x offsuit, stdioh, 21. Jul 2003 10:01 | ||
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| They are toilet paper. You need to catch 2 pair to be able to play them and if you're looking to catch 2 pair then you can play any 2 cards. AX suited can be ok, in late position with lots of limpers. Something like ATs or A9s can be ok to limp with in earlier position because if you flop an ace there is a chance that it is good, but without the flush outs you really don't want to be playing it. Where I think you can play a hand like A9s in early position is at a loose passive table. If you flop an ace with a backdoor flush draw then you can lead out and probably not get raised. Now if your flush draw comes you can bet into the turn and if not then you can check and probably fold to a bet from any kind of decent player. Often at a table like this even in this unfavourable situation you'll get a free river card. Still, even when you play it really well a hand like that is only marginally profitable. Really you should be throwing it away in early position too. As for AXo though. I'll defend my BB with AT and A9 if I am heads up, but if I catch an ace, bet the flop and get raised, I'll usually let it go. If I'm in the SB I'll limp if there are 6 limpers or so because now I'm hoping to catch 2 pair or get out cheaply. I might limp on the puck with AT or A9 as well because I'm in position and can play the hand a lot better. But I need to be against opponents who will limp with any ace and have lots of limpers before me. | ||
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| Re: Thoughts on A-x offsuit, spawgan, 21. Jul 2003 19:22 | ||
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| Thanks for the opinions. I had been noticing the only times these cards were doing me any good were in two situations: 1)A-2 to A-5 in late position with limpers trying to flop either the 2 pair or the srt8 draw. This has been marginally successful. 2) in the final 2 or 3 at a s-n-g or final tourney table. One other time I have had success with them is late in tourneys when I have gotten short stacked and the blinds and antes look to eat me up. Then I have been able to go All inn a few times and doubled up. Once again thanks for the help. | ||
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