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Server Time: 8/30/2008 2:03:46 AM PACIFIC |
 Perplexed at the expensive blinds, Dr_Monkey, 2. Jul 2003 06:41 | ||
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| I was in a 400 person limit tournament online recently. I had been playing very smart. I had about 1800 in chips at the 25/50 and 3000 at 50/100. There were probably over 200 people left. The average chip level was 1500. I felt I was in pretty good shape. When the blinds went 100/200 I had about 2800. A early to mid player raised an uncalled pot. He had probably the same size stack as me or maybe a little bigger. I was holding KK in late position. My first though was he had AA. Then I thought he probably had AK, then I though he has some low to mid pair. I thought about folding, but with KK if I can't call a raise now I may never. So I called. Everyone folded after me. Flop came 10 6 3 rainbow. Raiser checked. I figure I am ahead and bet. He calls Turn comes. Rag. He checks, I bet, he calls. I think I have him beat. River. More rags, He checks, I think I am ahead, I bet, he raises. Oh boy. What is that? Is he trying to bluff me out of the pot? I call. He is holding 10 10 so he flopped a set and slow played me. I think my pre flop call was correct. Since he checked to me after the flop and my hand didn't improve, should I have checked? If I bet and he doesn't fold, should I still bet the turn and river? I usually play single player NL tourneys and do pretty well. My downfall seems to be situations like this. I have a high pair or AK. Either raise or call a raise preflop. Flop comes and I don't flop a set and end up chasing. I bet hoping to get the other person to fold. Sometimes they get luck on the river, other times they flop a set. Once blinds get over 100, should I be checking? Especially without a set? I got KK later in the tourney, after losing amost all my chips and building them to 1500. I was late and raised after everyone folded.. Think it was still 100/200. They guy next to me called and everyone after folded. Flop came 7 3 3. I again figured I was ahead with 10s and 3s. I bet. As it turned out he had 10 3 suited. Now this hand I think he got really luck playing 10 3 after a raise. The other hand I think I should have checked, maybe getting to see the river for free and calling the river... | ||
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| Re: Perplexed at the expensive blinds, shorn, 2. Jul 2003 06:55 | ||
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| You definitely should have re-raised pre-flop because only 1 other hand beats you: AA. Once he checks the flop, you should bet hoping he has AK or AT. However, once he calls after you have shown such strength, it may be wise to check it down from there (certainly on the river). You might bet tht turn again and see if he was trying to peel one off on the flop and hit an Ace, but you MUST check the river if he calls you twice. Remember that you showed a ton of strength re-raising pre-flop. This means MUCH more in a tournament than it does in a ring game, so for him to call your re-raise, and call the flop, he had to put you on an overpair to the T AND HE STILL CALLED. That has got to tell you something. I would have re-raised pre-flop, bet the flop, checked the turn, and called or checked the river hoping to see QQ or JJ. | ||
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| Re: Perplexed at the expensive blinds, Dr_Monkey, 2. Jul 2003 07:18 | ||
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| I did think about re-raising preflop. But talked myself out of it. Figured if he had AA I was just wasting money. But I now see that the right thing to do is re-raise. I might have even made him fold. But I see the importance of showing my strength. If I re-raise and bet the flop and he raises, I should probably fold? How many people would bluff with a check raise in a tourney with the blinds that high. | ||
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| Re: Perplexed at the expensive blinds, shorn, 2. Jul 2003 07:29 | ||
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| I doubt the guy would bluff raise the flop after you have shown such strength on the flop. Again, this is where tournament play differs substantially from ring game play since it is a survival game. Also, why checkraise the flop with a monster if he can wait until it is more expensive on the turn/river. If you re-raise pre-flop, get called, and then get raised on the flop, I would most likely call the raise (since he could be doing that with JJ and QQ too). Then either check behind his turn and river checks or call unless (1) an Ace falls, (2) the board pairs, (3) a K comes, or (4) you can say with absolut certainty that he has either AA or TT. This is a really tough laydown with the board you described and I would have to have an incredibly strong read to fold KK even in the tournament. | ||
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| Re: Perplexed at the expensive blinds, Jav, 2. Jul 2003 10:41 | ||
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| There's really nothing you could do. You probably should have re-raised pre-flop; and it's possible he would have folded. But he probably would have called and seen the flop. Once he flopped the set with no Ace on the board, you were pretty much screwed. There's no good way to protect yourself against a set lower than your pocket pair. Especially when the board isn't scary. With no flush or straight showing, it would be really hard (and probably wrong) to lay down your K,K. I probably would have raised pre-flop, and bet the flop and turn (assuming he just called, and didn't raise the flop). I would definately have checked the river. I've done things like fold QQ trying to stay alive in tournaments, and then get blinded out kicking myself the whole way. All you can do is play your cards as best you can and hope for a bit of luck! | ||
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| Re: Perplexed at the expensive blinds, stdioh, 2. Jul 2003 12:12 | ||
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| Your mistake here was not getting your money in while you had the best of it. You had to reraise all in there with your KK unless you really read him for AA in which case you fold. It it too late in the tourney to risk an A hitting the flop. If you had shoved in there, he might have released his TT - if he hadn't at least you could call it a bad beat. | ||
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| Re: Perplexed at the expensive blinds, Paul Stine, 2. Jul 2003 12:31 | ||
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| on 2. Jul 2003 12:12 stdioh wrote: > Your mistake here was not getting your money in while you had the best of it. You had > to reraise all in there with your KK unless you really read him for AA in which case > you fold. It it too late in the tourney to risk an A hitting the flop. If you had > shoved in there, he might have released his TT - if he hadn't at least you could call > it a bad beat. I believe he stated that this was a linit tournament. Tough to get it all in when you have 14 times the big blind. Paul Stine College Station, TX | ||
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| Re: Perplexed at the expensive blinds, stdioh, 4. Jul 2003 09:04 | ||
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| Oh, my mistake. Sorry. | ||
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