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Server Time: 11/21/2008 1:35:18 PM PACIFIC |
 large tournament question, Jav, 27. May 2003 17:06 | ||
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| Warning, this is going to sound a lot like a whining bad beat story :) I entered an approximately 250 player NL HE tournament at Pokerstars monday morning. In the very first hand, I get A,A. I was in middle position, and someone raised about $200 (Everyone started with $1500). Hoping to isolate only one or two players, I raised about $300. Everyone folded but the other player, who raised to $1450. At this point I could either fold or go all in. I went all-in, and the other player turned over J,8s. The flop brought J,8, rag (of course), and I was out of the tournament in the first hand. This was particularly frustrating because I stayed up intil 5:00 AM to play in the tourney, but oh well... Now my question. I know A,A gets beat, and I'm not too upset about that. But is it wise to go all in in the first hand, even when you have a big adavantage? I could have laid down and had plenty money left to recover, but it just seems like that's a pretty good opportunity to double up early. I think I'd make that bet again, and just assume that I'm going to have to have some short term luck to win the tournment anyway.... But the main prize was 9 entries into another tournament, so I really only had to play to place, not necessarily to win. Anyway, thoughts? | ||
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| Re: large tournament question, mongi, 27. May 2003 17:23 | ||
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| I think you should have raised him all in from the beginning. Your reraise of him may have seemed like a power move to get him off his hand so he figured he could get you to lay your hand downby going all-in. By you going all-in he would not have had a shot to win the pot without a showdown and most likely would have mucked(who knows). Even if he mucked you would still win 200 plus the blinds, thats not bad early in the tournament. | ||
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| Re: large tournament question, tron, 27. May 2003 17:42 | ||
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| Since its a FPP points entries, most of the players going into this type tounament play rather loose due to the cost is insignificant. If this was real money, ur move is correct. At the start of a tournament, the inexperienced and gamblers are there to gamble. So, I would have made the same move as u. | ||
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| Re: large tournament question, Jav, 27. May 2003 17:44 | ||
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| That's an interesting point. Then the only people who would call me would probably be A,K or high pocket pairs, all of which play worse against A,A than a junk hand. | ||
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| Re: large tournament question, mongi, 27. May 2003 17:46 | ||
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| I just want to add something to my last reply. The fact that you were able to get all of your money in as well as your opponents before the flop was a fantastic situation for you considering the cards you held. You were a huge favorite to beat him you just got unlucky. | ||
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| Re: large tournament question, BigDMcGee, 28. May 2003 00:56 | ||
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| The situaltions where you fold AA before the flop in a tourniment are so few, that they almost don't bare repeating. And they certainly don't happen early in a tourniment when you're along way from the money. Your goal in a tourniment is to double up as quickly and often as you can... You should NEVER fold aces, unless you're in extrondinary circumstances ( Mike Caro has one such case. Something like you're three handed in a tourniment, one person has 250,000, the other has 250,000, and you have 5,000. you are in the big blind, the button goes all in, and the small blind calls. In this case, the reward of doubling up, doesn't match the value you get of your opponent being busted. But cases like this are so rare they can really only confuse you.) I don't care if you're just about to make the money, on the bubble, I don't care at what point in the tourney you are.. YOu are a Huge favorite heads up with aces, and if you're not willing to get all your money in then, when will you be. Your only mistake, if you'd call it that, is to raise so little. But then again, when I have AA, I want to trap in a worse hand... I want a maniac to make a huge bet back into me, because the odds are in your favor so highly. It's these's stat advantages that you are looking for in a tourniment ( and in poker in general) and if you lose, well, then you just lose. Your only worry with AA preflop is how to get as much of your stack in as you can. The reason you'd want to raise more than 300 would be so you don't trap yourself. If he has something like 77, and you raise so little, he's getting the right ( implied) odds to call if he puts you on a big hand. Because he can flop his seven, and bust you if you're not careful. That's why you want to give all draws the wrong odds to call, and get about half your stack in there as a raise. I think all is too much, personally, because you have to gamble a little, and have to give them a chance to make a mistake. Anyway, after I get re raised, with aces ( or if I get raised when I raise with aces) it's time to get all the chips in and don't look back. If bad beats didn't happen, there would be no game.. | ||
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| Re: large tournament question, stdioh, 29. May 2003 09:07 | ||
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| Of course. You should be willing to go all in with AA at any point in any tournament except for in some very exceptional cases...like if the big stack is all in, 2 small stacks are all in and you're the second biggest stack playing at the bubble, etc. Generally speaking you have any other single hand absolutely dominated. If you're worried about somebody hitting 2 pair, don't be. Even medium suited connectors are badly dominated by aces and they have the best chance of any. | ||
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