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Server Time: 11/20/2009 7:03:43 PM PACIFIC |
 pocket rockets, tron, 20. May 2003 16:19 | ||
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| AA UTG, (17k in chips) 200-400 blinds i raise to 800, guy under dealer button (18k)calls flop comes Q97 TWO SPADES. I BET he raises. I move all in he wins 2 pair q9. bad move? | ||
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| Re: pocket rockets, stdioh, 20. May 2003 16:43 | ||
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| How many players were left at the table? Generally speaking you should make more than a minimum raise to avoid letting in all kinds of players with crazy draws. Still, getting your money in here was important. You've got the overpair and you don't want anybody to have odds to draw to a straight, so a big bet is valid. Now when the guy raised you, you've got to figure that he is holding top pair top kicker, KK, or better than one pair. He didn't reraise you preflop, so he probably hasn't got KK. QK would probably yield a smoothe call. So depending on the size of your bet and his bet (important information), how many are left (important information), how good a player he is (important information), and how many get pair (important information), along with all the stack sizes of your opponents (important information), you might consider calling him. Pushing all in is maniacal and leads to a situation where you only get called when you are beaten. The worst thing you can do in poker is to make a bet where only hands better than yours will call it unless you are on a stone cold bluff. Obviously this isn't the time for a bluff. So if you are making a 1000 bet and he's coming back with a 4000 raise, it is time to drop your aces and run. Maybe he's even on a pair with a flush draw, but then he still has 15 outs to beat your aces and you shouldn't hang on. Survival is much more important than stack increase. So yeah, unless the information I don't have would change my mind, I think a fold here is the move. A call, maybe. A raise, hell no. A raise all-in, forget about it. | ||
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| Re: pocket rockets, noiseboy, 20. May 2003 17:05 | ||
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| I think your preflop raise could've been bigger. I can see betting that flop, but I wouldn't bet the farm, because if he called the larger raise before the flop, or raised you, you'd have to give him credit for a hand, unless you had some tell that he was on a bluff. People don't usually call a raise with Q9, it's true, but with a small raise people will get into the deck on you with some weird hands. My theory on all-in moves is I just don't want to make them very often unless I have to because I am short-stacked, or until the late rounds of a tourney. Basically, a lot of math goes out the window in favor of survival, until you get to the money. Take what I say with a grain of salt, however, as I have played mostly limit tourney's and not much NL. | ||
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| Re: pocket rockets, Andrew Wells, 21. May 2003 03:10 | ||
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| I agree with the first two replies that you didn't raise enough preflop. Something like 1500 with your 17K stack should have been appropriate. Without all the other information stdioh points out, it's hard to determine what could have been a reasonable course of action on the flop. How much was your flop bet by the way? Can I assume you and your opponent were the two big stacks? I suppose I'd bet about 2000 on the flop which should be enough to either take it right there or interest someone with a hand that can beat your overpair to let you know right away. Going all-in to a raise here depends a lot on how your opponent has been playing. Did you perceive him as being too aggressive or making power semi-bluff moves? Has he been sitting on the large stack for awhile? If this is a live game, did you try to elicit some tell before the bet on the flop by say cutting your chips and pondering for a bit? It's usually a good thing to have a healthy respect for another large stack before you get into the money. You don't have to eliminate him immediately, instead let him help you in the mission to knock off the short stacks. | ||
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