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Server Time: 12/2/2008 6:16:18 PM PACIFIC |
 keeping notes, LittleHewy, 19. Apr 2003 06:14 | ||
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| i'm a young, beginning player that is keen to research and learn as much as possible about the game before playing in anything but home games, where i find the low level of competition allows me to win more often than not. however, it has been suggested to me that i should keep notes of sessions to begin to analyze play. i find that after a session i normally want to crash straight away, and the next day it's hard to remember specific hands. what exactly should i attempt to be keeping solid notes on? any suggestions to make note taking a little easier would be great. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Dixie, 19. Apr 2003 06:46 | ||
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| i don't think you have to keep specific notes on anything persay considering you are just starting out. if i was you, i would be more concerned with developing a solid set of starting hand requirements, learning about position and drawing odds. a good book that is concise and easy to understand is Lou Krieger "Hold Em Excellence". | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, LittleHewy, 19. Apr 2003 06:59 | ||
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| thanks for the response dixie :) i do have a good theoretical knowledge of the game, as i've done a lot of research on play, odds and body language/tells, but what i need to start doing is implementing this stuff - which mainly comes down to discipline for me. i was told i should keep track of what i was doing, but as i said, after 8-10 hours i don't feel like jotting down stuff. anyway, thanks again. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Poker Crone, 19. Apr 2003 06:58 | ||
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| I am an advanced beginner, studying hard like you, and I keep notes every session -- LOTS of them -- and later review them as I type them into a file on my computer. I keep a small notebook and pen in my shirt or jacket pocket. As I go along I log how I played certain hands of special interest to me -- hands I think I played well or poorly. And of course I make notes about any tells I notice -- like the guy whose eyes flash open wide when he sees Aces or Kings in his pocket cards. I also log how much I came to the table with, how much I left with; when I started playing and when I stopped (to calculate win rate per hour); I note my tips (tokes) to dealers, food expenses etc. and I log this info into a spreadsheet I created. People tease me sometimes about writing a book, etc., but I just smile or joke back. Plus, people at casinos are used to props (pro players who play for the casino to prop up a table -- proposition players who play with their own money but get a modest hourly wage, too) making notes. PS: I think you are making a mistake only playing in home games --play with play money on internet sites that allow it -- and for very low limits, like for pennies, at the sites that have that option. ALSO!! Get Wilson Software's Turbo Texas Hold 'Em (or stud) --it is worth every penny it costs, a thousand times over. Good luck! | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, LittleHewy, 19. Apr 2003 07:13 | ||
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| thanks for the tip. you'll understand, i've been apprehensive about taking notes at the table, but i guess i'll just have to bite the bullet and cop the flak when opponents get smart. i do play online at PP for play money, and i find it very enjoyable, but even though i play to win, i find it hard as most others don't have any real respect - they just don't care if they lose. i guess it's an exercise in playing tight. now that i think about it, it's probably not a lot different from home games, except that i find it easier to intimidate people face to face. having said that, i am planning to start playing for pennies shortly, just to test it out. does anyone think that PP is not the place to play? i've seen some interesting posts that were dodgy on PP - anyone recommend any sites in particular? | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Poker Crone, 19. Apr 2003 07:35 | ||
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| You'll find that most of the time people ignore your note taking. I agree with you about people playing loose for play money at Paradise. I have found that at Pro Poker people are more serious and play tighter at all levels, including play money. But here's the thing -- people at casinos play loose too -- at $1/2, $3/6, and even $6/12!! So learning how to beat loose games is important. Does it mean playing tight as hell? A little loose? I can't figure it out -- that's why I play $9/18 where people play "by the book" and respect a bet, fold to a bluff, etc. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Paul Stine, 21. Apr 2003 12:30 | ||
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| on 19. Apr 2003 07:13 LittleHewy wrote: > thanks for the tip. you'll understand, i've been apprehensive about taking notes at the > table, but i guess i'll just have to bite the bullet and cop the flak when opponents get > smart. There are these little rooms in casinos called RESTROOMS. They offer a modicum of privacy. Use the cover of having a tiny bladder to take a break and write some notes. Since you are probably more interested in jotting note just after you screw the pooch rather than after you make a stellar play, getting away from the table will serve to let your kettle come off boil, as well. If you can't stand to set foot in the restroom, try the Keno Lounge, the sports book or even a bank of slots or VP machines that conceals you from the prying eyes of other poker players. Paul Stine College Station, TX | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, flintsword, 19. Apr 2003 08:10 | ||
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| Keep a Notebook. I found that I learned a lot about my play by examining my notes to a game. Online, nothing beats recording every hand and the flop for a while. They fact you are writing it down brings home what you have and what you are doing. A year ago, my playbook was littered with "SHFBF" (Should Have Folded Before the Flop). Less now and my results and earn rate has improved a lot. At a table, there is a bit of hostility towards the chip weasel writing in a notebook, but I have noticed an interesting coincidence: those chip weasels writing notes start with a rack and leave with two or more at the end of the night. Has anyone else noticed this? | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Poker Crone, 19. Apr 2003 09:56 | ||
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| At a table, there is a bit of > hostility towards the chip weasel writing in a notebook, but I have noticed an > interesting coincidence: those chip weasels writing notes start with a rack and leave > with two or more at the end of the night. Has anyone else noticed this? Absolutley!! I guess i am a chip weasel. what's a chip weasel??? i am a well-to-do chip weasel thanks to my note taking. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, flintsword, 19. Apr 2003 13:14 | ||
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| Sorry poker crone, that is a term I coined with some friends on our early visits to Las Vegas to describe the thin, young, sunglass/baseball cap, notebook scribbling player usually found crouched behind an enormous pile of chips. It was funny at the time. It only dawned on me later there may well be a connection between the notebook and the enormous pile of chips, but the term stuck. If someone really objects to it I will cease to use it on forum. By the way, in YOUR notes, what notation do you use to describe players? (eg) LAG = Loose Aggressive Good Player, <((((((><), etc. and do you describe all seat positions with the type of player? | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Mojo702, 20. Apr 2003 01:59 | ||
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| Is notetaking allowed at casino poker table? | ||
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| Re: allowed to keep notes in casinos?, flintsword, 20. Apr 2003 14:03 | ||
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| In Vegas there have been numerous instances where someone was taking notes. No ruling against, but I defer that question to the pros. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Don Quixote, 19. Apr 2003 11:15 | ||
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| Some online sites have a "notes" feature which is ok, but if you want to be serious about note taking, obtain software that does it all for you. I purchased PokerTracker for $25 a few weeks ago, and I can already see a difference in my game. I played for just over an hour last night at Empire Poker. One of the many features of my tracker is one that I used this morning to review last night's play. Board cards were shown for each game, and players that went to showdown had their cards shown. I am not a shill for PokerTracker.com, but just a happy camper. Their software records all possible information and then you can filter it any way you want. You can download the software for free, use it for 1,000 hands to see if you like it. If you do, you can then purchase it. Sometime around the end of May the price goes up to $40 (I think) because of a ton of added features. BTW Poker Tracker works only on Empire Poker, Party Poker, Poker Stars and Paradise Poker. IMHO I think Paradise Poker is the toughest online site. Poker Stars has very few low limit ring games. It is mostly a tournament site, but Poker Tracker does not now handle tournaments; however, I think it will be one of the new features when the price goes up. For those that already own PT's software, the upgrade will be free. Empire shares Party's software; so if you are playing on either site, you are playing people who have logged in on either site. Hope this helps. Don Quixote on 19. Apr 2003 06:14 LittleHewy wrote: > i'm a young, beginning player that is keen to research and learn as much as > possible about the game before playing in anything but home games, where i find > the low level of competition allows me to win more often than not. however, it > has been suggested to me that i should keep notes of sessions to begin to > analyze play. i find that after a session i normally want to crash straight > away, and the next day it's hard to remember specific hands. what exactly > should i attempt to be keeping solid notes on? any suggestions to make note > taking a little easier would be great. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Tommy waggoner, 19. Apr 2003 21:20 | ||
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| If you are at all serious about poker, It is a must that you keep records. You have to track your progress to know how you're doing. After each session, I list the name of the casino and date it, and write down the starting amount of money, and the ending amount, and I write down how much I either won or lost, and the start time and end time, and I also list what limit and game of course. This much, I think is essential if you ever plan to play seriously, as far as taking notes on individuals, I try to do that mentally, I don't bring a notebook to the tables, cause it is not that hard to remember, and I don't think a notebook at the tables would do much for my table image, if anything, it seems like that might scare some potential fishies away. You want them to have fun, and you want them to think you are having fun, not sitting there working. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Carl Heydman, 20. Apr 2003 13:41 | ||
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| Start with this free site. http://www.pokercharts.com. Then figure out what you want to keep in the notes, how you'll arrange them and most impotant, HOW ARE YOU GOING TO USE THEM. After that, the rest will be easy. | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, LittleHewy, 20. Apr 2003 18:17 | ||
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| thanks for the link carl, i've registered and i' m sure it'll come in handy. Gotta say, this is a great forum... | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, Mark, 20. Apr 2003 14:24 | ||
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| Keeping notes is essential to winning poker, however, i don't think it is a good idea to take notes at a live table. While there are many benefits to do so, you will probably give a bad impression to your opponents. Some fish who are there to gamble may not like the fact that you are taking poker seriously and will not give you any action without a made hand. If you anger/piss-off your opponents, they will probably tighten up and not give you any action, or some may mistake you for a pro and leave. mark | ||
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| Re: keeping notes, noiseboy, 21. Apr 2003 10:27 | ||
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| keep a pen and a small notebook with you. In a given session, there will be three or four "make or break" hands which will determine whether you go home a winner or a loser for that particular session. Those are the hands you need to take home and analyze to determine if what you did in the situation was correct. | ||
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