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Tournament poker improvements, Arlo Payne, 21. Feb 2003 15:27
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Nolan wrote something very good for Pokerpages and It brings me back to
where I stand and I will continue to fight for what I feel is required for
tournament poker to become a real force for players.


If we ever expect the tourney circuit to really work we must have a payout
to the top 25% of players in each and every tournament.

This would ensure the top 25% could over come a bad run of luck and
support themselves on the circuit.

It also would increase the number of entries in every tournament. This in
turn would allow payouts to the top 25% and still have huge payouts to the
final table.

Anyone interested can review my past posting on the subject.

As for myself I play only a hand full of tournaments a year and only a
select numbers of events. I play Omaha 8/B, mix games and a couple holdem
events and I am ahead of expenses for tournaments.

I play alot of different side games and have a strong winning record.

However with the present payout formats I have no desire to throw money
away playing in each event when I know it will be hard to reach the final
table. But with a payout to the top 25% I don't think I would miss many
events. Hell who out there does not feel the can reach the top 25%.
Cashing at a tournament feeds egos why not feed more egos?

Many people on the tournament trail play way to many events which burns up
money and brain cells. If your stong game is limit holdem why in the
world would you enter a 7 card stud event when you know the payout worth
your time is only there if you reach the final 4?

Tournament poker must be able to support players on to tour or it will
never grow.

Side note:
I know if ran an online site I would greatly increase the number of
payouts in my tournament and I would let the whole world know about. Best
way to keep players is to have them cash. I will bet anyone that does put
into place tournaments with 25% of the field getting a payday will see the
tournament entries reach huge numbers. Because who out there doesn't feel
the can make it to the top 25%?
The smallest payout should be at least twice the buy-in and don't worry
about the final table numbers being low the increased number of entries
will more than make up for the lower percent of payout in real dollars.

Arlo(getting off his soapbox)Payne



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Re: Tournament poker improvements, flintsword, 21. Feb 2003 18:26
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Alro, You are probably correct. I organized chess tournaments for decades, and the pressure from the masters to get 90% of the prize fund was constant. Chess tournaments became more popular and mainstream when chess players got ratings and class tournaments allowed people to compete at their levels. That said, anyone could play in the Open sections (WSOP for us) and get their teeth kicked in by the grandmasters. Maybe a ranking system for poker players is an idea whose time has come. Make the prize fund more democratic and formalize a player's skill level is an idea.
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Re: Tournament poker improvements, andriy, 2. Mar 2003 08:05
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> play in the Open sections (WSOP for us) and get their teeth kicked in
> by the grandmasters. Maybe a ranking system for poker players is an
> idea whose time has come. Make the prize fund more democratic and
> formalize a player's skill level is an idea.

I don't really see, how rankings that exists in chess could be implemented in poker. There should be something like World Poker Organization (like FIDE) that would control the whole thing. I am not very familiar if sth. like that exists. And other thing, the most skillful poker players are on my opinion ring players. How would one measure who is the greatest player? It is a very difficult task, because conditions are NEVER the same for everyone. It could have been done for tournaments, that's for sure. I am like you (I presume) a chess and poker player and I find both games very interesting...Are there many chess players also poker players in USA and viceversa? here (Slovenia) there are quite many chess players, some poker players, but I haven't met a person yet that does both? Do you think that chess knowledge can be useful to a poker player? I think that chess teaches logical thinking +thinking. Both things poker player needs the most. Do you agree?

have fun, andriy
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Re: Tournament poker improvements, stdioh, 24. Feb 2003 06:58
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on 21. Feb 2003 15:27 Arlo Payne wrote:
> Nolan wrote something very good for Pokerpages and It brings me back to
> where I stand and I will continue to fight for what I feel is required for
> tournament poker to become a real force for players.
>
>
> If we ever expect the tourney circuit to really work we must have a payout
> to the top 25% of players in each and every tournament.
>
> This would ensure the top 25% could over come a bad run of luck and
> support themselves on the circuit.
>
> It also would increase the number of entries in every tournament. This in
> turn would allow payouts to the top 25% and still have huge payouts to the
> final table.
>
> Anyone interested can review my past posting on the subject.
>
> As for myself I play only a hand full of tournaments a year and only a
> select numbers of events. I play Omaha 8/B, mix games and a couple holdem
> events and I am ahead of expenses for tournaments.
>
> I play alot of different side games and have a strong winning record.
>
> However with the present payout formats I have no desire to throw money
> away playing in each event when I know it will be hard to reach the final
> table. But with a payout to the top 25% I don't think I would miss many
> events. Hell who out there does not feel the can reach the top 25%.
> Cashing at a tournament feeds egos why not feed more egos?
>
> Many people on the tournament trail play way to many events which burns up
> money and brain cells. If your stong game is limit holdem why in the
> world would you enter a 7 card stud event when you know the payout worth
> your time is only there if you reach the final 4?
>
> Tournament poker must be able to support players on to tour or it will
> never grow.
>
> Side note:
> I know if ran an online site I would greatly increase the number of
> payouts in my tournament and I would let the whole world know about. Best
> way to keep players is to have them cash. I will bet anyone that does put
> into place tournaments with 25% of the field getting a payday will see the
> tournament entries reach huge numbers. Because who out there doesn't feel
> the can make it to the top 25%?
> The smallest payout should be at least twice the buy-in and don't worry
> about the final table numbers being low the increased number of entries
> will more than make up for the lower percent of payout in real dollars.
>
> Arlo(getting off his soapbox)Payne

I think that expanding to pay more players is a good thing insofar as it has been done at WSOP, but expanding to pay 25% of people is silly. Where does this money come from? If 25% of people double their money, then there is a lot less to pay the final table with, devaluing the win and causing the tournament to play boringly. If you want to grind out your tiny advantage (not that there is anything wrong with that), a ring game is the place to do it. Tournaments are about the big payday.
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