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Server Time: 3/21/2010 4:06:45 PM PACIFIC |
 Online poker debate, Mark B., 14. Feb 2003 09:36 | ||
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| I play both live ring games as well as a significant amount of online poker. While I enjoy playing the live game, online poker is more profitable for me. There are two reasons why. First, when I log into an online game, I immediately search the tables for known fish. I have notes on these players and it is like walking into the best ring game.....everytime. Second, I live 30 miles form the poker room. The cost of gas, vehicle wear and tear, dealer and waitress tipping and food associated with going to the casino makes it a $50 loser before I set foot in the door. It is very difficult to overcome that everyday. At the end of the day, I can play at home, save $50 and an hour of my time travelling and jump into games that there are known fish in. I really am interested to know if I am missing something. I am a former online skeptic and now an online poker advocate. It is also worth noting hat I play at the larger, more established sites. I have not recognized any game integrity problems. | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, Hinxy, 14. Feb 2003 11:14 | ||
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| on 14. Feb 2003 09:36 Mark B. wrote: > I play both live ring games as well as a significant amount of online poker.I would be interested to know which sites you play and recommend > While I enjoy playing the live game, online poker is more profitable for me. > There are two reasons why. First, when I log into an online game, I immediately > search the tables for known fish. I have notes on these players and it is like > walking into the best ring game.....everytime. Second, I live 30 miles form the > poker room. The cost of gas, vehicle wear and tear, dealer and waitress tipping > and food associated with going to the casino makes it a $50 loser before I set > foot in the door. It is very difficult to overcome that everyday. At the end > of the day, I can play at home, save $50 and an hour of my time travelling and > jump into games that there are known fish in. I really am interested to know if > I am missing something. That's a bit subjective.....If it's all about money and your having success then....why change to live games? Personally I like the contact with other players,handling chips,cards etc.....Apples and oranges I think.I am a former online skeptic and now an online poker > advocate. It is also worth noting hat I play at the larger, more established > sites. I have not recognized any game integrity problems. | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, Wren, 14. Feb 2003 13:55 | ||
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| I played A LOT of online poker last year. Netted over $5000 playing low-limit games (most often $.5-1 and $1-2 limit, and $.25-.5 NL) and was a huge proponent of online play. Not only for the reasons you mentioned, but the following others: speed of play (many more hands/hour are dealt than in B&M cardrooms), no tokes, comfort, ability to play more than one table at once, promotions, freerolls, etc. However, I just recently started playing live again, and I realized just how much more profitable these games are than average games online. Even low limit online players tend to be much more solid than the average player at $5-10 B&M table. Futhermore, and very importantly, online play prevents you from picking up tells, and this is a huge disadvantage to the winning player. Now that I'm playing live more regularly, I don't even have the desire to play online anymore. Now, admittedly, I have very limited experience with B&M cardrooms (I have only played at 2 of them here in Ontario), but my guess would be that the average B&M anywhere would be more profitable to play at than an online site on an average day. In conclusion, if you are serious about winning, I'd suggest that you don't confine yourself entirely to online play. 30 miles is not a huge distance to drive for a profitable live game. Good luck! | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, stdioh, 14. Feb 2003 14:36 | ||
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| > importantly, online play prevents you from picking up tells, and this is a huge > disadvantage to the winning player. Now that I'm playing live more Indeed. I am an uncommon positive player in that my reads are very good and I pay very close attention to them. Thus I do very well against very bad players in a B&M cardroom, but online I am powerless and helpless. When you can look across the table and tell that the next three people are about to fold, you can steal from mid position, etc, etc, etc. > yourself entirely to online play. 30 miles is not a huge distance to drive for a > profitable live game. Indeed. I don't know how a trip to the cardroom 50 km away could be costing you $50. Are you driving a tank there or something? I drive at least that far to my local cardroom and it take 1/4 of a tank round trip. I toke big hands, but consider it part of the rake. I don't tip for my free drinks (and wren thinks I'm cheap because of it) and my costs are negligeble. A trip there costs me about 1/2 hour worth of playing time at my average win rate, and that includes breakfast at the casino restaurant. I generally tend to carpool down there too which makes the gas even cheaper. | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, NickZack, 14. Feb 2003 15:03 | ||
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| >I don't tip for my free drinks (and wren thinks I'm cheap because of it) I think you're cheap too and if I were her I would leave a little something floating on top of your drink (earwax, booger, ash). This is probably one of the things that annoy me the most in a poker room. She is trying to make a living and putting up with crap and deserves to get paid for it. Go drink out of the sink if you are too cheap too tip. Mike | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, stdioh, 17. Feb 2003 09:19 | ||
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| > I think you're cheap too and if I were her I would leave a little something floating on top of > your drink (earwax, booger, ash). This is probably one of the things that annoy me the most in > a poker room. She is trying to make a living and putting up with crap and deserves to get paid > for it. Go drink out of the sink if you are too cheap too tip. Well, the wait staff shares their tips, and I am very polite. There are a lot of players who treat the women there like shit, but tip well. I think they are more likely to get a floater than I am. The fact of the matter is that I'm only willing to cut into my bottom line so far in tipping, so either I'll tip the dealers worse and give it to the girls, or I'll stiff the waitresses entirely. I feel that the dealers deserve the money as their job is difficult and requires skills. The girls slinging coffee could be replaced by 13 year old Mexican kids. | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, Dan Contreras, 14. Feb 2003 13:57 | ||
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| The rake online vs the B&M Casino where I play at is drastically better. 3/6 B&M Rake and Toke: 10% to a $4Max + $1 Jackpot + Toke=$6 3/6 Online: $3 Max. That kind of break adds up pretty fast! on 14. Feb 2003 09:36 Mark B. wrote: > I play both live ring games as well as a significant amount of online poker. > While I enjoy playing the live game, online poker is more profitable for me. > There are two reasons why. First, when I log into an online game, I immediately > search the tables for known fish. I have notes on these players and it is like > walking into the best ring game.....everytime. Second, I live 30 miles form the > poker room. The cost of gas, vehicle wear and tear, dealer and waitress tipping > and food associated with going to the casino makes it a $50 loser before I set > foot in the door. It is very difficult to overcome that everyday. At the end > of the day, I can play at home, save $50 and an hour of my time travelling and > jump into games that there are known fish in. I really am interested to know if > I am missing something. I am a former online skeptic and now an online poker > advocate. It is also worth noting hat I play at the larger, more established > sites. I have not recognized any game integrity problems. | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, stdioh, 14. Feb 2003 14:39 | ||
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| > 3/6 B&M Rake and Toke: 10% to a $4Max + $1 Jackpot + Toke=$6 > > 3/6 Online: $3 Max. > > That kind of break adds up pretty fast! That really depends on where you are. The casino that I play in Vancouver spreads 10-20 and 10-20 with a kill. Max rake on each is $3. True, rakes online are much less, but I'd rather pay a rake of 1 small bet if I'm beating the game by 2 BB per hour in a B&M than half a small bet if I'm beating the game by 0.5 BB per hour online. And while many online cardrooms may be honest, it is just way too easy for players to collude over the phone whilst playing. | ||
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| Re: Online poker debate, Roy Cooke, 15. Feb 2003 12:46 | ||
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| I think this is right on...You do lose something by not being able to visualize your opponents (I am assuming you read them better than they read you), but online has many advantages. Roy Cooke on 14. Feb 2003 09:36 Mark B. wrote: > I play both live ring games as well as a significant amount of online poker. > While I enjoy playing the live game, online poker is more profitable for me. > There are two reasons why. First, when I log into an online game, I immediately > search the tables for known fish. I have notes on these players and it is like > walking into the best ring game.....everytime. Second, I live 30 miles form the > poker room. The cost of gas, vehicle wear and tear, dealer and waitress tipping > and food associated with going to the casino makes it a $50 loser before I set > foot in the door. It is very difficult to overcome that everyday. At the end > of the day, I can play at home, save $50 and an hour of my time travelling and > jump into games that there are known fish in. I really am interested to know if > I am missing something. I am a former online skeptic and now an online poker > advocate. It is also worth noting hat I play at the larger, more established > sites. I have not recognized any game integrity problems. | ||
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