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Server Time: 9/7/2008 8:53:24 PM PACIFIC |
 Pokerschool Online, jim grass, 9. Nov 2002 15:47 | ||
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| After a year of being a member of pokerschool I must say thats its been quite beneficial to me in getting acquainted with the many forms of tournament poker out there... if you are quite disciplined and analytical of your play then the school would be of tremendous benefit... The downfall of the school is that its online and that many of the players are there for many different reasons and I really wonder should many of them be wasting thier money and time there for thier play indicates they`re quite new or just dumb...Luck is the major factor in any of thier advancement.. I have never allowed luck to factor into my play for obvious reasons.. I find great frustration now in the school because of the newbie factor and any strategical and or tactical thoughts are rather fruitless most times... i`ve won a few live events and placed well on other occasions in small events and need to get into some middle buy in events to feel any hope of progression from this point on .. In closing the school gave me a decent foundation to work from BUT be very clear that I made the decision to play my best even though it proved fruitless on a great many occasions. I conclude by saying that I take my hat off to Mark and Tina They were always extemely helpful to me in my year of involvement... My final day is november 15th as a member. jim | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, 2jelsky, 9. Nov 2002 19:45 | ||
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| as you travel down lifes trail of tournaments your best efforts may prove fruitless more than you may realize for luck is indeed a very large factor more than you may realize thus you will find luck to be, not the thing that determines how much you win, for it is luck that does that skill is the element which determines how little you loose | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, jim grass, 10. Nov 2002 05:06 | ||
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| *for luck is indeed a very large factor more than you may realize * Agree your point above has merit for a newbie way of non thinking; but not ever to me.. To put myself in a position to take down a hand (get lucky), it would be for example to hold two overcards to a ragged flop against perhaps two average players..etc.. That is how i deal with the luck element without going into great detail... I do not ever rely on getting lucky as it is commonly percieved by most.. So yes your remark is the reality for most unskilled players out there and thats great for me and other knowledgable players.. jg | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, Lee Vaughn, 10. Nov 2002 07:44 | ||
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| I think the point of 2jelsky's post was not to RELY on getting lucky, but to accept that luck does have an impact on tourney's because of the quick rising blinds and not being able to reach into your pocket for more money if you have a bad run. (among other reasons) No one is telling you to play any two cards and hope you get lucky, but to say that luck in poker (especially tournament poker) is just for the unskilled doesn't fit. In a tournament so much depends on building up your stack. Weather you can do that depends a lot on what cards you happen to be dealt early - a random event that some might call luck. Advance skills will only help you so much if you just don't have the cards and once you end up short stacked you are at a severe disadvantage to those big stacks. We all know the cards will even out over time, but in a tourney where your time is limited that will not always happen. Hope that helps, Lee | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, jim grass, 10. Nov 2002 08:32 | ||
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| . Advance skills will only help you so much if you just don't have the cards and once you end up short stacked you are at a severe disadvantage to those big stacks. Yes lee i hear your thoughts and i`m not afraid to make steal moves against certain individauls without the cards.. The beauty here is that big stacks will call small stacks with almost anything and that means if i double up i`m back to moving my stack again.. jg | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, 2jelsky, 10. Nov 2002 14:44 | ||
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| jim, I fell that Lee did a good job of expanding upon what I had said. It just seems to me that either you do not realize, or will admit, that luck plays such a huge part in determining who wins. And especially, that the bigger pots are most apt to be the result of luck--two or three players having big hands at the same time is not the result of skill. It is the result of luck. No, I do not suggest that you play weak hands, and try to get lucky. | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, mickblueeyes, 10. Nov 2002 15:47 | ||
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| absolute jibberish and uneducated comments on poker by 2jelsky | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, Jacob, 10. Nov 2002 16:14 | ||
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| Im sure of one thing in tournaments a skilled player will get more "In the money" positions than the newbie or luckbased player just as he will get more profit in normal games..but in the looong run. Theres a lot of good players out there and I seriously doubt any of them wouldnt consider themself lucky if they won the world championship :) | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, 2jelsky, 10. Nov 2002 22:59 | ||
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| mickeyblueeyes, I am sorry you feel that way. I wonder if you understand my position? I never suggest that players rely on luck. Players should allways use their best knowledge and abilities. But if their starting hand is 2,7 o, their skill will tell them not to play that hand. that is as it should be. But if they had that hand while they were the big blind, and and there was no raise, then they would probably see the flop. If the flop was 2,2,7 giving them a full house, that would be luck. Players have no controll over the cards they get. It is luck. And if some other player had pocket 7s, then he would be the lucky one. Not the most skillfull. Remember to use all of your skill, and hope you get lucky. , | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, Mark, 11. Nov 2002 06:56 | ||
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| 2jelsky I think the problem some people have with your comments is that what you call luck is really just odds. Hitting a full house on the flop from the BB with 7-2 isn't really luck. The odds are it will happen, but very rarely. I've noticed that when I first tightened up my play, I got lucky alot. But what really happened was I was playing cards that had better odds of winning, so they won more often. Pocket A's will win about 35% of the time. So if you win with them, did you get lucky? NO, the odds tell you what will happen. Did you get lucky because you were dealt pocket A's? NO, because everyone else will get them dealt the same percenage of the time as you. I do agree luck has SOME bearing on tournament play and any other short term situations, but i do not agree with luck being responsible for all your wins. Mark | ||
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| Re: Pokerschool Online, mickblueeyes, 11. Nov 2002 08:09 | ||
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| Exactly mark. Luck is happenstance. Statistics rule poker--statistics have rules, luck does not. Skill allows us to put the odds in our favor the most we can. If I score trips in my starting hand in stud, the odds are 424 to 1 of that happening. My starting hand is "luck"--what I do with it is governed by skill. In your example, starting with a 2, 7o is the luck portion of the game--I was dealt crappy cards. However, my abilities can allow me to play that hand. If I am facing a few very weak players and I know I can bluff them out of a pot by betting strong from late position--my skill overrides the luck of my starting hand and the odds of making a hand offered by my cards. Luck has very little to do with this game. | ||
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