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Server Time: 12/3/2008 10:51:38 PM PACIFIC |
 winning amount to strive at online, Andy, 27. Aug 2002 12:13 | ||
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| Hi all! I've been thinking about what profit you should strive at when you play online poker. In live games they say you should make 0.8-1.5 BB an hour. Online where there are so many more hands delt per hour I estimate the amount you should make to 3-6 bb an hour(full handed tables). Is that too optimistic from my side of view? 12 days ago I bought 100$ worth of chips, now my bankroll has growth to 1100$. 600 in tournament winnings( 100% to make it to the final table with average of 114 players so far :-) and 500 in 3/6 hold'em ring games. I loose 1 session out of 6,normally 10BB. That's is also the average amount I win playing 3h a day with the losing sessions counted. Does anyone of you think these results are ok if they keep going a couple of months or should I make more money?.Lets say I stick to the 3/6 limits. And also, when do you recommend me to move up a level? I can beat those games too, I know it. But I,m not mentally ready since a losing session can hurt my bankroll too much and make me play bad. See ya Andy | ||
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| Re: winning amount to strive at online, Mike Caro, 27. Aug 2002 14:08 | ||
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| on 27. Aug 2002 12:13 Andy wrote: > Hi all! > I've been thinking about what profit you should strive at when you play online > poker. In live games they say you should make 0.8-1.5 BB an hour. Online where > there are so many more hands delt per hour I estimate the amount you should make > to 3-6 bb an hour(full handed tables). > Is that too optimistic from my side of view? > 12 days ago I bought 100$ worth of chips, now my bankroll has growth to 1100$. > 600 in tournament winnings( 100% to make it to the final table with average of > 114 players so far :-) and 500 in 3/6 hold'em ring games. I loose 1 session > out of 6,normally 10BB. That's is also the average amount I win playing 3h a day > with the losing sessions counted. Does anyone of you think these results are ok > if they keep going a couple of months or should I make more money?.Lets say I > stick to the 3/6 limits. > And also, when do you recommend me to move up a level? I can beat those games > too, I know it. But I,m not mentally ready since a losing session can hurt my > bankroll too much and make me play bad. > > See ya > Andy Hi, Andy -- Unfortunately, I DO think your estimate is somewhat unrealistic. Even though there are more hands per hour, there are fewer psychological weapons and tells available to a serious player. These factors tend to cancel each other. Also, remember that in $3/$6 games and lower, the rake is more significant as a percentage of your total money won than in larger games. Fully one-and-a-half big bets per hour may be paid as rake, even by sophisticated players who are discreet about the hands they enter pots with. I think that earning $12 an hour in a $3/$6 game is a significant achievement. That would mean you'd have to win $21 or so per hour from your opponents, when you consider the $9 or so per hour paid in rake. If you can win at that level (and, yes, world-class pros might earn more if they were forced to put on an exhibition), you're doing very well, indeed. Straight Flushes, Mike Caro | ||
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| Re: winning amount to strive at online, Andrew Wells, 27. Aug 2002 20:48 | ||
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| Those are really great results. You have managed to avoid any sessions from hell where you seem to do everything right, but can't win a hand. If you can maintain 3 to 6 big bets per hour over the next 500 to 1000 hours of play, then and only then can you consider it extraordinarily significant. I'm not trying to berate your success, but you've probably been just running good for awhile. Also, keep your tournament results separate. It's how you handle hours and hours of marginal or unplayable hands that will really determine your poker prowess. | ||
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| Re: winning amount to strive at online, steve martino, 27. Aug 2002 22:33 | ||
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| I have won over 4 bets /hour online for over 800 hours. It was, I must admit, in the .5-$1 game playing 2 tables at a time. I began playing at Planet pokers 3-6 game ( the lowest limit offered at the time) I started with a $50 buy in , very little experience, and the Lee Jones Holdem book. I won $800 in my first 60 hours and lost it in my next 10. After going back and forth for a while I cashed out (luckily with my original 50 intact), took a break and started reading more books. I sent my $50 toParadise Poker and started playing $2-$4. I did pretty much the same as in the 3-6 game,not really winning but managing to stay even. After about a year of back and forth, I worked my way down into the .50-$1 game and started winning.I started playing 2 tables at once which works real well in the low limit games I play in. I thought if two games is better than 1, then 3 is better than 2. I got another computer and a router and started playing in True Pokers $1-$2 game(lowest they offer). while playing at Paradise. It's working out good so far. Two months ago, I made what I hope is my final move out of .5-$1 poker(except for early in the morning when they don't always have 2 $1-$2 tables open) I'm getting sick of ( ) . Anyway, since playing 2 tables on-line you are seeing about 4 times more hands per hour than in live play, you will reach statistical significance faster.But try not to get too excited until you've played more hours. Steve (i should've paid more attention in writing class). | ||
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| Re: winning amount to strive at online, Andrew Wells, 28. Aug 2002 10:52 | ||
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| Multiple tables is a whole different situation. I think 2-3 BB/hr. is reasonable on-line at low limit, since you are getting about 80 hands per hour average. I tried playing two simultaneous a few times, but I found that I lost some edge doing this. I wasn't able to follow the play of hands where I folded at one table and concentrated on the other. I was playing 2-4 hold'em on one and 3-6 hold'em on the other each time. Maybe at the lowest limits this is easier, or maybe I just don't perform well constantly shifting windows. Just how much advantage do you think you are giving up playing simultaneous? I suppose it's not as much for you as the extra hands per hour compensates, but do you think your play is still at it's best rather than playing one table only? If the .50-1.00 tables are really weak as you suggest, maybe playing two tables at once there is a good alternative to repairing a badly damaged bankroll more quickly. I agree with you that playing long hours at the lowest limit takes too much time and effort. Could you tell us a little more about playing multi-tables, particularly any deviations you make vs normal single table play? | ||
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| Re: winning amount to strive at online, steve martino, 28. Aug 2002 20:55 | ||
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| I agree that you can't play two tables (or 3 in my case ) as good as you can on 1. All The books say I should be watching the action during hands I'm not involved in. I do this as much as I can but I am missing alot of it. I also ocasionally make button pushing errors because the screen changed as I was clicking my mouse. It doesn't happen often , but it does reduce your edge.I've been playing 2 tables for almost 2 years, and I found that the increased hands per hour does more than compensate for the loss in edge.It's usually not that confusing because I'm folding most of the time. This works in the .5-1 and hopefully $1-$2 games because I am playing a mindless ABC style poker . Basically playing like a unimaginitive rock most of the time. This would get me killed against good observant players, but I'm playing against poor players. I belive this style works well in the game I'm playing in. Many players in on-line games don't play as long as people do in a card room. This reduces the value of watching them, when compared with the gain of hands per hour. Also, I believe most players would have better emotional control playing in two games . It is much easier to fold when another hand is coming up in a few seconds. There is also less time to steam after a bad beat. However, If you do, it will cost you more because your steaming through more hands. I also never play longer than 2 hours without taking at least an hour break. If you don't like stwitching screens , you can play with 2 computers(my router has 5 plugs)at 2 different casino's. I paid for my second computer with poker money and I've gotten it back quickly throuh playing more hands. I really don't use a different strategy than if I played at 1 table.I'm not saying everyone should play two tables at once, but with my style and level of play it has worked well for me. Steve | ||
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| Re: winning amount to strive at online, Gunnar, 28. Aug 2002 16:17 | ||
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| 3-6 BB per hours sounds alot. Ive played alot at 3/6 and below and I think that seems to be pushing it. Sure if you get the cards and stay out of the bad beats, put there will always be days when everything will go wrong. Ive played about 600 hours and gain about 2k, thats 3.5 bucks per hour. I played mostly 2/4 and 1/2. So thats around 1 big blind per hour. I dont manage to play perfect all the time, but I think that 2-3 big bet per hour is the best you can do in the long run at this level of online poker. | ||
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| Time will tell, Andy, 29. Aug 2002 01:11 | ||
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| Hi all! Thanks for your answers and opinions. Guess time will tell wether my play generates 3-6bb/h. The key to success online in my opinion is leaving those games where you get drawn out with hands like AA,KK and similar strong hands where you hit the flop but the maniacs keep getting their J 3 os twopairs. Those runs never seems to turn into winning sessions. Leaving the table after an extremely good start may also generate more bucks in the long run since you tend too hit the peak after 20.-30min and you don't want your opponents winning back their money :-). It also looks statiscly good with 150$ in 30 min(50bb/h). See ya Andy | ||
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