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Server Time: 2/13/2012 8:29:34 AM PACIFIC |
 showing laydowns, john stolzmann, 4. Aug 2002 18:25 | ||
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| the other week i showed the table a fairly big laydown, and i believe that i suffered the price...the $15/30 hand played as follows.... four players had limped and i looked down to pocket fours on the button...this isn't the greatest hand but i had correct odds (including implied odds) to continue with the hand so i limped along and we took the flop 6 handed. the flop came a dreamy A 9 4 rainbow. the small blind checked, the big blind bet, two players folded to the cutoff who raised. i could raise or call with the hand as a slowplay. due to the texture of the flop, i chose to raise, as calling two bets cold on a rainbow flop alerts opponents as there are no draws...i had also slowplayed a set earlier in a similar situation, so i hoped that opponents would not put me on a hand as big as a set if i three bet. the big blind four-bet the pot (he could have AK here as this player probably wouldn't have raised from the BB with it), or he could have top two, possibly A4 and he could have 99 for a set of nines. i knew he would have raised preflop with aces. the cutoff called and i capped the pot at 5 bets. to my surprise, the big blind bet in the dark!! this means betting before he has seen the turn card. i have seen this player play two-pair very strongly, often overplaying them, in my opinion. this player wouldnt bet in the dark in that spot without AT LEAST A4, and probably not without top two. he simply would not bet in the dark with 94 (he WAS in the big blind after all). when the blank came off the cutoff called once again, and i just called, thinking that the chances the big blind had flopped a set of nines were too great to justify a raise (i knew the cutoff probably had only one pair of aces...he was a calling station). the big blind lead in the dark again, and the river came another ace. there was simply no hand that i could beat. even A4 would have caught me on the river. the cutoff, blind to the situation, called the bet. i had an easy decision to fold...and i laid the 4's face up in the muck...A9 (aces full) dragged the pot, and the bewildered cutoff seemed a bit ashamed of his AJ. WHY DID I DO THAT!?!? part of the reason that i laid it face up was because my dad was in the game and i wanted to show him that i was a good player...to show him a good laydown. this didnt make it worth it...and i could have told him later. although the laydown was an easy one for me to make, no player at the table could have dreamed of laying down a full house for one bet, in a huge pot, on the river. they looked at me with amazement. while these players may have gained a new respect for me, they also became aware to the fact that i am capable of laydowns that they are not. i found that they began to raise more liberally against me, especially on the turn, when they could put a play on me. previously my opponents were playing very straightforwardly and now they began taking shots at me--i even had to start paying hands off more than normal!...this lasted a few hours...eventually i think most of them forgot, or left...but i had put myself at a disadvantage for no reason by showing the laydown. i think you'll all agree (next time YOU want to prove how smart you are) that the expectation lost by showing great plays or good laydowns is worth more than the respect your opponents will have for you. thanks for listening, john stolzmann | ||
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| Re: showing laydowns, Roy Cooke, 4. Aug 2002 19:25 | ||
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| on 4. Aug 2002 18:25 john stolzmann wrote: > the other week i showed the table a fairly big laydown, and i believe that i > suffered the price...the $15/30 hand played as follows.... > > four players had limped and i looked down to pocket fours on the button...this > isn't the greatest hand but i had correct odds (including implied odds) to > continue with the hand so i limped along and we took the flop 6 handed. > > the flop came a dreamy A 9 4 rainbow. the small blind checked, the big blind > bet, two players folded to the cutoff who raised. i could raise or call with > the hand as a slowplay. due to the texture of the flop, i chose to raise, as > calling two bets cold on a rainbow flop alerts opponents as there are no > draws...i had also slowplayed a set earlier in a similar situation, so i hoped > that opponents would not put me on a hand as big as a set if i three bet. > > the big blind four-bet the pot (he could have AK here as this player probably > wouldn't have raised from the BB with it), or he could have top two, possibly A4 > and he could have 99 for a set of nines. i knew he would have raised preflop > with aces. the cutoff called and i capped the pot at 5 bets. > > to my surprise, the big blind bet in the dark!! this means betting before he > has seen the turn card. i have seen this player play two-pair very strongly, > often overplaying them, in my opinion. this player wouldnt bet in the dark in > that spot without AT LEAST A4, and probably not without top two. he simply > would not bet in the dark with 94 (he WAS in the big blind after all). when the > blank came off the cutoff called once again, and i just called, thinking that > the chances the big blind had flopped a set of nines were too great to justify a > raise (i knew the cutoff probably had only one pair of aces...he was a calling > station). > > the big blind lead in the dark again, and the river came another ace. > there was simply no hand that i could beat. even A4 would have caught me on > the river. the cutoff, blind to the situation, called the bet. i had an easy > decision to fold...and i laid the 4's face up in the muck...A9 (aces full) > dragged the pot, and the bewildered cutoff seemed a bit ashamed of his AJ. > > WHY DID I DO THAT!?!? > > part of the reason that i laid it face up was because my dad was in the game > and i wanted to show him that i was a good player...to show him a good laydown. > this didnt make it worth it...and i could have told him later. > > although the laydown was an easy one for me to make, no player at the table > could have dreamed of laying down a full house for one bet, in a huge pot, on > the river. they looked at me with amazement. > > while these players may have gained a new respect for me, they also became > aware to the fact that i am capable of laydowns that they are not. i found that > they began to raise more liberally against me, especially on the turn, when they > could put a play on me. previously my opponents were playing very > straightforwardly and now they began taking shots at me--i even had to start > paying hands off more than normal!...this lasted a few hours...eventually i > think most of them forgot, or left...but i had put myself at a disadvantage for > no reason by showing the laydown. > > i think you'll all agree (next time YOU want to prove how smart you are) that > the expectation lost by showing great plays or good laydowns is worth more than > the respect your opponents will have for you. > > thanks for listening, > > john stolzmann Well stated and very accurate. I agree with your statement in a big way! Roy Cooke > > > > | ||
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